VIBRATIONS OF DOOM MAGAZINE
ISSUE #58
This entire issue is lovingly crafted and dedicated to a TRUE 80's metal
veteran, Mark "The Shark" Shelton. We were fortunate to see Manilla Road in
Atlanta on their last ever U.S. tour in 2017, and the interview we did with
Shelton was absolutely wonderful. It is indeed a shame that he passed away
from a heart attack while overseas, but he played shows and presented metal
until his last day. July 27th, a few days before this issue is scheduled to be
released, Mark, you will definitely be missed... Here's to hoping that you're
jamming away with some of our other fallen brethren who have already left us.
Our mailing address:
Vibrations Of Doom Magazine/DOOM Radio
c/o Steven Cannon
P.O. Box 1258
Suwanee, GA 30024-0963 USA
TABLE OF CONTENTS:
REVIEWS:
- BLACK OATH "To Below And Beyond"
- BLOOD FEAST "The Future State Of Wicked"
- DAMMERFARBEN "Herbstpfad"
- DESOLATION ANGELS "King"
- DREAD SOVEREIGN "For Doom The Bell Tolls"
- DROIDS ATTACK "Sci Fi Or Die"
- GALLILEOUS "Stereotrip"
- GRAVE DIGGER "Return Of The Reaper"
- HELSTAR "Vampiro"
- ICE WAR "Ice War"
- KHEMMIS "Hunted"
- KING WITCH "Under The Mountain"
- MEDEVIL "Conductor Of Storms"
- NASHEIM "Solens Vemod"
- NIGHTPROWLER "Unholy Rawness"
- NOKTURNAL MORTUM "Verity"
- OBSESSION "Order Of Chaos"
- PAGAN ALTAR "The Room Of Shadows"
- SAMAEL "Hegemony"
- SKELETON WOLF "Skeleton Wolf"
- SOLITUDE "Reach For The Sky"
- SPIRITUS MORTIS "Year Of No Light"
- TANK "Valley Of Tears"
- THROES OF DAWN "Our Voices Shall Remain"
- TYGERS OF PAN TANG "Tygers Of Pan Tang"
- VISIGOTH "The Revenant King"
INTERVIEWS:
- CIRITH UNGOL
- DARK ANGEL
- DROIDS ATTACK
- HOBBS ANGEL OF DEATH
- MANILLA ROAD
- NORTHERN CROWN
- RITUAL
- WARBEAST
- EDITORIAL NOTATIONS
Holy shit, a new full length from Italian doomsters Black Oath! Had no idea it
was out, probably because for awhile it was released independently through the
band. Suffice it to say, it took me quite a long while to really get into the
disc, simply because there was an AWFUL lot of melodic passages and vibe to
this disc. I still don't feel it stacks up to their previous two killer efforts
"Ov Qliphoth And Darkness" or "The Third Aeon." The approach is a little
different, that's for sure. After the short 2 minute instrumental "intro,"
which I might add retains a really dark feeling, the dark acoustic like guitar
opener of 'Wicked Queen' starts the disc off, and though there's still a dark
feeling there, it's unusually laid back compared to what they've done in the
past. Still, the vocal melodies do shine, with some catchy choruses throughout,
alongside a few structure and tempo changes, including a heavier set of
instrumentation just to "balance" things out. 'I Am Athanor' starts right off
the bat with some speedy leads, though the melodic sung parts are quite catchy,
I had problems with this track at first. It's almost TOO melodic in many parts.
This tune goes through A LOT, which might have added a bit to the confusion,
but there's no denying the band keeps things interesting for the almost 8
minutes in length. 'Mysterion' too starts off doomy and somewhat heavy, keeping
the darkness out front but reined in quite a bit. This is a tune that retains
the doom tempo almost from start to finish well. 'Flesh To Gold' is easily one
of my most favorite cuts on the disc, especially the way the soaring and
emotionally charged vocal work at the end grabs you and crushes you with great
force. The ending of this song is one of the most amazing moments on the disc,
but the band isn't quite through with you yet; as we witness another truly
awesome cut in 'Healing Hands Of Time,' with great singalong passages and
soaring vocal work on the choruses, by now a good trademark of this disc. The
melancholy and somewhat doom tempo proves this band hasn't abandoned the doom
elements completely; they're just a bit stepped back compared to the melodies.
'Sermon Through Fire' was mostly a 5 minute instrumental with a little spoken
word passage to it; not really much to it but the ending darkens things a bit
and brings the heaviness to the forefront. Finally, we have CD ender 'To Below
And Beyond,' which brings up some guitar elements you've heard earlier on in
the album. They do try and keep it interesting, but the synth choir voices at
the end alongside the lone piano notes took a turn out into left field, leaving
me going "why?" Still, they take the huge roaring twist vocally right before
the songs, what I will term "first end." Overall, the band is still crafting
good material, but as I said, it's definitely going to strike you as quite a
different recording from what they've done previously. In the end though, it's
still doom, and still, vocally this may be some of the band's best work. It's
not a perfect cohesion, but an album that has worked it's way into my heart and
collection, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that I digest these albums FULLY
many times before committing pen to paper.
Contact: Doomentia Records.
Holy shit dude, next thing I expect to read is "Sam Kinison found alive." Yep,
the latest vocalist to tackle the microphone (and newest since their
"reformation" sometime in the late 2000's) sounds JUST like what you'd think to
hear if the beloved comedian Sam Kinison took over for a thrash metal band. And
quite frankly, that sick "auuuuugh!" vocal style is what pushes many of these
songs RIGHT over the top! And old Sam, uh, I mean, Chris Natalini, starts the
disc off with a long winded scream that shows this CD ain't taking any
prisoners or showing any signs of slowing down... Well... More on THAT in a
minute. A blistering whirlwind of speedy yet thrashy riffs with very quick
opener "INRI" and we're underway. Right on into 'Off With Their Heads,' which,
if you didn't pay attention to the track change and difference in time, you'd
swear this track was a continuation of the first. Some absolutely PSYCHO lead
riffing comes courtesy of track 3 (in case you lost count) 'Brethren,' a pretty
straightforward but brutal affair. Now interestingly enough, Blood Feast this
time around chose to play around with some slower tempos (on followup 'By The
Slice,' but unfortunately it doesn't take well with their crazed assault.) There
are a few odd riffs in this cut as well, but things REALLY take a nosedive with
the cut 'Who Prays For The Devil,' definitely one of my least favorite tracks
on the record. YES, I still love doom metal, but it's hard to really take this
cut in. However, there's still some cool stuff to find within this cut, so it's
not a complete loss. The choruses REALLY suffer the most on this one. One of my
favorite tunes was 'Last Rites,' which plays up more on the dark and eerie
riffing, and is one of the very few times a slower approach works well here. It
mainly has to do with the absolutely crushing thrash riffs. When slower is used
properly, a track like 'Nein' hits all the right senses. 'Remnants' was an
absolutely ripping thrash instrumental, clocking in at almost a minute and a
half, before the disc blinds you with some swirling crazed lead guitar assaults
to round out this 5 minute piece entitled 'The Burn.' Nothing totally original
or innovative here, but this ripping thrash assault is power driven by the
crazed and maniacal throat rippings of one Chris Natalini, who has REALLY made
his mark here... The blood will get boiling and the rage factor significantly
increased, and I daresay this will become a favorite among those who remember
this band from the 80's (though surprisingly, it's one of the few 80's metal
bands I hadn't had the chance to listen to).
Contact: Hell's Headbangers Records.
Yeah, yeah, I know... A CD from 2012... I've held off on reviewing this CD for
quite some time, because frankly I didn't quite know what to make of it. We
reviewed their "Im Abendrot" album back in issue #52, getting damn near a
perfect score, as it is a near masterpiece. The band still utilizes lots of
different tempos, structure changes and speeds, but they're not as pronounced
as the debut. In fact, I daresay that much of this 7 song affair is
instrumental in nature, as your opening track is a short 2 minute instrumental,
then track 3 and THEN track 5. And CD ender 'Vintervisa' is mostly a
"retelling," so to speak instrumentally wise, of the opening cut, this time
utilizing female vocals instead of the blackened ones. It's a strange disc, for
sure, and it seems to me like there's an almost folkish doom metal element
permeating the disc. After your opening instrumental (which has nice folkish
violins, or is that a cello, which is melancholic and eerily beautiful), we cut
to the first "real" song, in 'Im Spatherbst,' sadly one of the weakest cuts on
the disc. Usually, the varying and sometimes dizzying yet diverse elements play
as their greatest strength: here, the slower, almost doomy instrumentation
finds itself in a strange mix with the blackened vocals. Personally, I think
they should have used a clean sung voice for much of this track, but that's a
personal opinion. It hits home more towards the end of the track, but still
it's not a terrible opener. The followup is one of the three instrumentals
mentioned; mostly melodic acoustic guitar work and it's not really driving the
point home for me. 'Zu Nachtlicher Stund' soon rights the ship a bit, however,
and this time the folkish influences turn an almost epic sound out of this
track, right before the ADD fired brains of this group steer the ship in a
complete 180 turn and pour on the blackened instrumental fury. Much better
tune here. And though I somewhat complained about THREE instrumentals on a
mere 7 track disc, it's track 5 'Lov I Hoststormen' that completely blew me
away! This is a cut featuring ONLY synths and higher noted violins but man it's
put together so well, it's a "top ten" of instrumental tracks for the ages!
And finally, the fast paced blackened instrumentation wastes no time in
cranking up cut 6, 'Und Winters Kalte Kehret Ein,' proving that if they had a
mind to, Dammerfarben could indeed craft an epic, Nordic style black metal
masterpiece. This cut has more of the blackened fury than any other cut on the
disc, but true to form and fashion (or anti-fashion, as the case may be), they
throw a curveball at the proceedings, threatening to bring doom metal to the
forefront. But in fact, the slower proceedings are almost waltz-like in
quality, proving once again that Dammerfarben indeed won't sit still long
enough for you to get comfortable.
Still, with all that being said, the disc seems rather experimental in nature,
begging me to ask first off, WHY only 7 songs? It's almost an EP for Odin's
sake, barely hitting the 30 minute mark! And WHY 3 instrumentals? And a lone
female voice on the CD ender? Overall, it's a bit too "light hearted" in many
places, really, compared to their stunning debut. It's obviously not a failure,
mind you Dammerfarben are way too skilled to "fail," but I will ALWAYS prefer
the debut over this album any and every day. Still, there's some nice and
melodic stuff in amidst the "madness," and that instrumental gets to me every
time. What's next?
Contact: Northern Silence Productions.
A band who released a somewhat NWOBHM flavored album in 1986, and then somewhat
disappeared until this newest release in 2017... Right off the bat I will say
I didn't really know what to expect out of this U.K. based band who has since
relocated to the States. Suffice it to say this band knows how craft some
catchy material with hints at heaviness, something that many bands across the
spectrum of the New Wave Of British Heavy Metal movement knew a LOT about.
The albums starts off with the riff-tastic, almost folk inspired lead guitar
work of the cut 'Doomsday.' Good sung vocals, and I detect a marked similarity
in vocal approach, not unlike Dave Wall's efforts on that 1986 release. Paul
Taylor knows how to craft his delivery to fit the mood of the song, something
that will become more evident as some of the material takes a darker turn later
on down the disc. And of course the lead solo work is good; I would expect that
since both Keith AND Robin were duelling guitars on the debut full length in
1986 that their guitar skills had only improved markedly in over 25 years, and
this album proves the point well. Energetic and rockin' riffs bring up the cut
'Another Turn Of The Screw,' this time adding a somewhat heavier headbanging
flair to the proceedings, not forgetting to craft some decent choruses while
power rocking. Slow and melodic follows with 'Devil Sent,' and this band does
melodic quite well. 'Rotten To The Core' follows up with one of their heaviest
and darkest cuts on the record (and by no means the lone wolf of the bunch),
adding some cool heaviness at the track's end, though you're never bludgeoned
with it. 'Your Blackened Heart' I didn't care for at first, it's a heavier and
darker number that took me quite some time to really "get." At first I thought
that maybe it just was forced heaviness, but I somewhat get a tad turned off by
the heavier guitars; overall it's the weaker choruses that made me turn away a
bit. Still, not a horrible tune by any means; just not playing to the strengths
of the band. And what, might you ask, are those strengths? Glad you asked.
Followup 'Find Your Life' became, to me, one of the most enjoyable of the bunch
and proof positive that NWOBHM bands crafted amazing melodies that were heavy
in their emotional content; not necessarily the bludgeoning over the head with
sonc riffery that makes this track one of the best on the record, one that will
stand with you for a long time. Ballad like it may be to start off with, but if
you stick with it I'm sure you'll agree that the heavier choruses soar and the
vocal work is amongst it's best here. 'Hellfire' was an interesting twist, a
kick ass, heavy as hell headbanging affair, and something I didn't really think
I would hear on this type of disc. Catchy choruses, etc. make this a somewhat
surprise standout. And if you think 'Find Your Life' was such a fluke, get a
load of followup 'Sky Of Pain,' which contains JUST as much epic melody and
catchy singalong choruses as the aforementioned hit, and it also has some
genuine rockin' feeling to it. It's a little less "ballady" as 'Find Your
Life,' to a degree, but doesn't stop it from being another amazing highlight.
Sadly, the disc closes on somewhat of a weak note, as CD ender 'My Demon
Inside,' in my honest opinion, was way too weak to close out the album (I feek
'Sky Of Pain' did that job nicer than any other cut on the disc). It's not
terrible, by any means, but it's too melodic, too laid back, and not enough
catchiness going on here. Adding a bit of insult to injury, the song just fades
out at the end. Still, you'll find good solos within, and I dare say that save
for a few blunders, the band is definitely not only firing on all cylinders,
but they took a few risks that definitely paid off and will turn some heads in
many different directions. Kudos to the band for branching out JUST enough to
keep people from scratching their heads, while understanding the basic flavor
and formula of the NWOBHM era brought into the "modern day" era. I definitely
look forward to seeing what else the band can come up with on future releases;
possibly the heavier sounds will permeate, or maybe there will be more material
akin to 'Sky Of Pain' and 'Find Your Life.'
Contact: Desolation Angels.
Here's something interesting... A 6 song affair, this time with only TWO
instrumentals instead of three. The disc is "shorter," song wise, but there's
NO bad songs here... The reason this scores higher, even with two almost
useless "filler" pieces. Though I will admit, the opening instrumental (which
is also the title track, go figure) does set the disc up nicely. 'Twelve Bells
Toll In Salem' starts things off, and it's a 13 minute affair, folks. Very
mournful guitar work, and against a minimal instrumentational backdrop, the
vocals shine quite well here. There's a lot of solo instrumentation to be
heard, which isn't unsurprising given the song length. On to 'This World Is
Doomed,' which absolutely ROCKS! Killer rockin' guitar work opens this track up
nicely; an explosive more uptempo treat from Alan and company. You start
noticing some psychedelic and swirling guitar work; pay attention because THAT
becomes more impressive later on. Alan does some of his most vicious and
scathing work on this track, filled with venom, fire and fury! Then the
aforementioned somewhat useless instrumental 'Draped In Sepulchral Fog,' which
runs about 2 minutes. Didn't care much for the scrapey guitar work at the end.
Could have given us another song. I'm going to skip track 5 for right now,
because I want to discuss this in depth, but the CD ender 'Live Like An Angel,
Die Like A Devil...' Yes, it's a Venom cover. And to add psychedelic guitar
riffing to a heavy track... Alan could do Cronos' job for him if he decided to
give up Venom, that much is for sure. The end of the track was a little bit of
a tease, I think... Are we going to someday have another Dread Sovereign cover
of Venom's 'Witching Hour?'
Alright, the reason I held off on track 5, 'The Spines Of Saturn.' HOLY MOTHER
OF THE COSMOS, someone Out-Hawkwinded the mighty Hawkwind! This has to be the
most surprising cut on the disc, complete with spacey synths, those psychedelic
guitars and still retaining a doomy feeling. Something I thought I'd NEVER hear
Alan and company pull off. To me, this is more like an EP, but dammit if this
isn't the best album Dread Sovereign has ever created. Sure, I'm kinda pissed
that they had to add two instrumentals to what essentially is a 6 song affair,
but they got every song RIGHT, as opposed to their last disc, where there were
a few tracks that weren't quite solid. I still recommend getting this gem, as
it has enough to keep you interested for QUITE awhile.
Contact: Van Records.
Damn! The mighty riff... Hymns have been offered up to it, and people the world
over bartered up their souls just for the chance to hear it. Megadeth's "Peace
Sells But Who's Buying" album proved Mustaine made a contract with the devil to
procure more great riffs in three songs than most bands can muster their entire
careers. And Droids Attack crafts an entire ALBUM around the power of the riff!
Folks, this album is kick ass from start to finish. "Stoner metal" is what this
band is pigeonholed as, though I detect a bit more in here. Loud, shouted/sung
vocals accentuate the heaviness that punches through this album like a steel
drill through the earth's crust. Okay, insane descriptions aside, just about
every song on this disc is great. Even the opener 'Die Glocke,' though starting
out with a bit more laid back fare, contains rockin' riffage, though the few
points detracted for it's taking awhile to get up off the floor and start
cranking the riff... Though with vocals, it seems more like an intro! 'New
Plague,' here we go. My favorite cuts here are the one-two punch of 'Clawhammer
Suicide' followed by 'Brahma Astra,' the former cut containing great catchy
choruses and quite aggressive and loud, and when Brad yells 'it's time to stop
fucking around,' they MEAN it!! Start/stop riffage reigns supreme here! The
latter is just fucking cool altogether, it's a CRUSHING heavy tune, complete
with 'Bombs away!' in the choruses. Simplistic, but it's as effective as a
twenty ton sledge hammer to the face! And this tune incidentally contains tons
of instrumental passages as well, like they decided to throw in some almost
improv jamming in there while keeping it heavy! 'The Maze,' a noteworthy almost
two minute piece, is an instrumental! And it's heavy! And riff-addled! And it
ROCKS!! There is quite an abundance of instrumental passages to be found in
many songs, though 6 and 8 minute songs NEVER get boring here. Might I also
mention 'Mashenomak,' which is a VERY slow doom metal tempo like piece? It's
not all faster headbanging pace, and there's some singing too! Want more? Check
out 'Mashenomak Strikes Again,' the followup... Yes, complete with rockin'
riffs and fuck, what's this? A Saxophone that ROCKS??? Sax solo?!? Damn, these
dudes thinking outside the box. By track 8 though ('Rebirth,') some of these
riffs sound like they're interchangeable with 'Brahma Astra,' but fuck, who
cares!?!? The two final tracks 'The Annunaki' and 'Enoch' have some surprises
of their own, but damnit I've said more than enough already!!! Where the FUCK
has this band been all my life, and they've got like THREE other full lengths?
WHY isn't this band bigger than they are? WHY the fuck are you still reading
about "Sci Fi Or Die?" BUY this album or die, goddamnit!!!
Contact: Droids Attack.
You'd never think to find a stoner rock band coming out of Poland of all
places, a land known more for extreme bands like Behemoth, Vader and
Decapitated. But like the oddity that is Honcho and The Satellite Circle from
Norway, we find the most amazing bands in the strangest places. Now granted,
Gallileous started out life as a more funeral doom sort of band, complete with
extreme vocal work, but slowly over their career morphed into a heavy, fuzzed
out stoner rock band. Which is where we found them in 2016, and I must say I
enjoyed this album a LOT more than one of their previous efforts "Necrocosmos."
Right from the get go, though, this looks to be a disaster, with opener 'Eaten
By The Universe' containing some rather odd clean sung vocals. The song title
gets repeated quite a bit, but the guitar work is fuzzed out and kinda heavy.
It's not a bad tune, but definitely not one of my favorites. Funny thing is,
this cut is not even 3 minutes long, like the track 'Open Window,' which is
another cut I wasn't too crazy about. This one contained a LOT of higher
register singing, and a few strange repetitive guitar work near the end. Still,
the power of the riff compels, meaning these two cuts aren't the disaster they
seem to be. 'Sonic Boom' was a rip rockin' treat, and many of these tracks will
be stuck in your head for a long while. Still, the doom metal roots are not
totally abandoned, which made 'Born Into Space' an absolute treat, with the
slower vibe and almost etherial sung vocals. 'Dust On My Back' starts off with
crunchy rockin' riffs, keeping things near a midtempo pace and bringing lots of
solo instrumentation before the slower and heavier doom carries us to the end.
It seems to me that Gallileous is at it's absolute best when giving these songs
a bit of space to breathe and grow; the faster and shorter songs oftentimes
aren't their best, even if a number of 3 and 4 minute songs do their best to
make you rethink that position. If they're rockin' hard, they're great, and for
that there's no shame. The songs have good variety to them, and even the
spacey, more melodic 'The Sound Of The Stereo Sun' makes for a good listen. I'd
love to know what kind of effects they're utilizing on the guitars, as it's
seemingly a bit different from the usual stoner rock fare with Sunn, Green and
Orange amplification. Not a perfect record, but I definitely dig the heavier,
stoner rock end of the spectrum these guys are travelling down!
Contact: Gallileous.
Haven't really listened to much Grave Digger, well, not since I had the amazing
"Heavy Metal Breakdown" on cassette. That was their first record. Thankfully,
what impressed me most about that record was how heavy they could be, while
still retaining that snarling, evil and dark vocal style that just slices the
endings off your nerves... In a good way! Still, after the somewhat interesting
intro (which serves as the title track), I must say the first two tracks didn't
instill much confidence. 'Hell Funeral' is a bit of a speedy number, and it's
okay, but doesn't really pack much of a punch. Too much power metal oriented,
and I mean more in a modern day sense. Followup 'War God' is another fast tune,
it's okay as well, but nothing to rave about. Then the electronic opening of
'Tattooed Rider' kinda reminded me of the opening of Priest's 'Turbo Lover.'
Still, hands down one of the meanest and most bad ass cuts on the record, a
true head bangin,' fist waving metal fucking ANTHEM. Adding multivocals to the
choruses is something that works well here; you'll find them doing this A LOT.
Followup 'Resurrection Day' is no slouch either, some dark and heavy yet
punishing riffs keep things at a frenzied pace, and the choruses keep it heavy.
'Season Of The Witch' is another down and dirty skullcrusher, kudos to the band
for the Middle Eastern guitar riffs opening the track up (though I fail to see
the significance on a track with this particular subject matter). 'Road Rage
Killer' might sound like a silly subject to tackle, but it's a speedier number
that reminds me of heavier 80's styled speedy power metal. And it's definitely
got that Judas Priest vibe, but with a MUCH heavier edge. We're still rockin'
here folks, as the onslaught continues with 'Grave Desecrator' utilizing an
interesting tactic: bringing the crushing heaviness while allowing the choruses
to "lighten" things up a bit. It's still a mean rockin' cut. 'Satan's Host'
reminded me of a more punk tinged rocker, and it's a fun little tune. And
another one of my alltime favorites off this disc in 'Dia De Los Muertos,' man
what a kick ass track, and fun to sing along to as well. One mean riff rockin,
kick ass tune. I use that term a lot, 'cause that's what the majority of this
disc does. 'Death Smiles At All Of Us' was an interesting track, a bit less on
the bone crunching heaviness; more of a modern day era power metal tune. It's
cool, but not the dirty, down and heavy rocker I'm wanting. Still, CD ender
'Nothing To Believe.' It's the damn ballad folks. And the rough gritty vocals
do NOT hold up well trying to sing this one in a more melodic fashion. The
choruses aren't bad though, well, when they "heavy" it up a bit, but most of
this shouldn't have been done, in my opinion. It's a skullcrusher to be sure
with lots of kick ass tunes, and I daresay it's damn enjoyable. Yes, I know
they have since released a new album, but there's older stuff I wanted to
cover, and this one deserved second mentioning...
Contact: Napalm Records.
Holy crap!!! If power metal were this dark, aggressive and just rabidly HUNGRY
like this, I would be such a HUGE fan!! I've never heard a power metal singer
who literally SOUNDS like he has 300 years of vocal experience under his belt.
Whatever else you may think about the almighty Mr. James Rivera, I think this
is the most ungodly record of Helstar's career. And I absolutely enjoyed "A
Distant Thunder" and "Burning Star." However, I never got a chance to hear
"Nosferatu," which may be the reason I'm so overtly skullcrushed by this album.
People say this album is in the vein of "Nosferatu," and yes the Vampire theme
continues, which is a very apt persona for Mr. Rivera. Dark acoustics, heavy
thrash riffing, punishing drums, and of course the Rob Halford like high ended
notes that Rivera pushes way past the stratosphere. The man exudes an air of
snarling, sneering and downright sinister power, even employing some almost
black metal vocals; witness the song 'Abolish The Sun' near the end for some
jaw dropping monstrous moments. SO... How about the rest of the band? Well,
new guitarist Andrew Atwood is definitely no slouch; he plays with precision,
speed and power, but most importantly KNOWS how to craft emotionally laid
solos. Very important when many of these tunes have several of them to choose
from. 'Black Cathedral' was one of the first tunes I heard, and I FIRST heard
it in a live setting when Helstar for the very first time in their career
played in Atlanta last year. The low toned vocals work so well here, and damn
near everywhere else, that you imagine this centuries old vampire at his most
dark and powerful. Check out the live clip we uploaded on our facebook page for
his pre-song banter. You won't find a 'Run With The Pack' type of catchy,
anthemic rocker, though 'Repent In Fire' comes about the closest with those
heavy, multivocal shouted choruses. No sir, this is all about creating a dark,
haunting, sinister and dangerous feeling that pure evil incarnate is RIGHT
around the corner. Just when you think you haven't heard anything different on
this record, 'Abolish The Sun' comes along and displays an almost doom metal
approach from start to near-finish. These are some crushingly heavy tunes,
folks, and so very dark for what power metal normally gives off. My only
complaints are quite few: 'Off With His Head' is a bit too straightforward for
the skill and power this band possesses, but that's a somewhat minor complaint.
These songs run about the 5 minute mark, though the 6 minute doom metal like
piece 'Abolish The Sun' rather makes sense. And to end the CD, some beautiful
violins, cellos and melodic acoustic guitars alongside Rivera singing in a
surprisingly melodic tone, showcasing James' "softer" side of delivery. Such a
masterful album that will leave you completely engulfed in a nightmarish,
sinister world, definitely gets my vote for power metal album of 2016, even if
it REALLY is a mixture of dark punishing thrash and power metal. No, not much
from 2016 comes close, well, maybe except for the Visigoth album... But that's
a story for later on in this issue...
Contact: Ellefson Music Production.
There's been a LOT of talk about Ice War, and most of it positive. This album
pops right out of the gate with some rockin' guitar work and an almost
galloping guitar pace which is found throughout the disc. A quite energetic
tune in 'Battle Zone' to start the disc off. The vocal work here is mostly
higher toned, though never TOO high (like some power metal singers we cringe
at). Followup 'Dream Spirit' reminds me of that NWOBHM approach yet more in
line with what the Swedes were doing with 80's metal. A more melodic approach
here and I dare say a tune that could have been found on several NWOBHM single
releases from "back in the day." Now my most major complaints: The two followup
tracks are among the worst I've heard on the record. 'Standing Rock' goes for
sheer speed and power, but the choruses are really bothersome and the guitar
work doesn't sit well with me. I can't even get through this tune or the next
one; followup 'I Am The Prisoner' has some cringing moments, with those
"whoah-ooooooh's" which REALLY grate the nerves. Ice War chose to utilize some
very odd guitar riffs too, which made this tune that much worse. However, we
get back to some killer rockin' riffery with 'Slaver's Whip,' complete with
some choppy guitar work bordering on thrash. Cool choruses, too, which are a
standout on this disc, though they are usually limited to "naming" the title of
the track they appear on. 'Reverence Of Gold' sees our one man band leader
utilize a rare lower register, complete with some uptempo rockin' riffs, while
'We Will Stand' and CD ender 'Falling Out' close the album out superbly with
not one, but TWO anthemic like cuts. 'We Will Stand' seems to be a bit more
complex than the rest by utilizing some structure changes and daring to be a
bit more "daring," so to speak, in it's choice of instrumental passages, while
'Falling Out' has some of the best vocal work on the disc, choosing to soar and
rise in delivery with the choruses. It is fun to sing and does make for a great
CD ender track. Still, there's a TON of repetition in the vocal and lyric
department; not a huge distraction since the songs are fairly short (not one
song manages to ever reach the 5 minute mark, and 3 minutes is the average
length of many). I'm not completely overwhelmed but there are quite a few good
songs on this 8 track affair... That being said, those two songs REALLY drag
the score down, but there's still plenty to enjoy from this solid outing.
Contact: Shadow Kingdom Records.
High praise abounds for this band from Denver, Colorado, and the praise is all
deserving. It's those riffs, man... Right from the opening track, you hear
those "bright and full" guitar leads that are the innovative cornerstone of the
entire disc. Still, these purveyors of massive doom can "bring the pain," so to
speak, choosing to inflect some harsh brutality riff wise (witness the brutal
death throes of 'Three Gates,') and the crunchy guitar openings of the title
track. And if you're a fan of Pallbearer, then you'll be delighted to hear the
spellbinding duo of Ben and Phil work their vocal magic. Still, I felt that to
add extreme vocal work was a bit out of place on 'Candlelight,' the only blight
to this masterful affair. The sudden drop into funeral doom was the first and
most obvious clue. It was an awkward switch: Khemmis has no need for extreme
vocal work here. We mentioned 'Three Gates' earlier, though, and the death
vocals actually worked well here. Contradicting myself am I? Not when you
realize that on this track, Khemmis is actually emulating November's Doom in
fine fashion, complete with a bit more uptempo pace. Still, they know when to
bring the doom back in. 'Beyond The Door' is a thing of beauty, very mournful
and melancholic, and those soaring vocals! And a few blackened vocals do their
magic near the end; oh yes, I'm seeing more cohesion here. The last two tracks
probably have more instrumental passages than the rest, though our CD ending
title track has some rockin' riffs that take up a lot of space. They know how
to jam (though I wish they'd bring more of the heavier rockin' to the table -
very small complaint though), they bring the crunchy dark doom, and they can
flat out occupy a very nice space in my CD collection. For fans of Pilgrim,
Pallbearer and the like, there's another band you desperately need to add to
your shelf.
Contact: 20 Buck Spin Records.
Scotland, Scotland... Hmmm... What do I know about music from Scotland? Well,
Alestorm's unique brand of Pirate metal for one... As for 80's metal, there's
Chasar, brilliant NWOBHM lads. Hell, I know more about 80's metal bands from
Ireland (Trojan, Killerwatt, Blackwych, etc.) And maybe I'm a tad out of touch,
but a heavy brand of doom metal? Female fronted? And the music doesn't stop
there; truly branching out and incorporating quite a few diverse elements
within these 9 tracks. Right off the bat, the opener 'Beneath The Waves' will
remind you of how truly heavy and ominous doom SHOULD sound. In fact, I'm sure
there's a bit of Candlemass and early Sabbath worship going on here. The riffs
though, are MASSIVELY heavy, nearly all the way throughout the disc. The
percussion is absolutely floor crushing, and the bass guitar gets equal time to
shine, but the absolute star of this disc is Laura Donnely, who is a massively
BALLSY heavy fucking metal singer. She soars, she sings, and she is such a
powerful presence within this band that (as I saw one reviewer harp on) she
doesn't NEED to have her vocals pushed forward into the mix. Her absolute
acrobatic vocal abilities shine; nowhere more than on the cut 'Solitary' (which
in fact, reminds me a LOT of the Orchid title track to their "Capricorn" album
in execution and "heavy slowness.") The doom madness crushes with 'Carnal
Sacrifice,' in which a nice doomy build effortlessly transposes into some
faster headbanging and soul crushing heaviness. It's down to a bit of melodic
doom with 'Solitary' (which was already mentioned), but folks, it's still HEAVY
despite being a tad "laid back." And the title track: Holy shit, did this band
EVER pick the best song on the record for that honour. Fast raging guitar work,
soaring vocal acrobatics, and suddenly drops down to some soul crushing massive
heavy doom. All in a 4 and a half minute song. Another good doomy track in
'Approaching The End,' man you just never know WHERE this band will take you.
And the almost "ballad" like piece, where Laura proves that she can sing, but
it's still a HEAVY voice. Almost at odds with the slightly ballad "atmosphere,"
yet the bluesy guitar work manages to pull you in. It's different, but somehow
still works. "Bright" leads pull you in for the start of 'Hunger,' and I dare
say if 'Under The Mountain' is their best track for a title track, 'Hunger'
gets the nod as the most "accessible" track of the record; kinda reminds me of
how Bobby Liebling wrote 'Star Lady' and the band KISS wanted to buy it. This
could easily have been a "doom metal hit single," where the usually heavy
handed vocals of Laura scream more metal than anything else, proving once again
her versatility and diversity. The last two tracks on the CD raise eyebrows
immediately, as they are the fastest on record: 'Possession' is downright evil
and sick; still managing to throw in some surprising slow almost funeral doom
moments, while CD ender 'Black Dog Blues' is the lone disappointment on the
record for me due to a rather odd set of vocals and some rather odd guitar work
near the end. It's a bit too frenetic for what's going on, though you cannot
deny the aggressiveness and heaviness are still in full force. Overall, it's a
crushing record that proves Laura is one of the most powerful vocalists in ALL
of metal; one that will give most dynamic male singers a run for their money.
On par with the heaviness and majesty of Orchid's first full length, King Witch
(shouldn't that be QUEEN witch?) has provided the world an absolute skull
crushing MONSTER of a first album; dare I say this band SHOULD win newcomer
doom metal band of the year for 2018???
Contact: Listenable Records.
Okay, so the story goes something like this: Medevil, hailing from Canada, take
part in a sort of "battle of the bands" competition to take the grand winner
all the way to the Wacken festival in Germany to play. Suffice it to say,
Medevil don't walk away with the top prize, but they have been gaining a lot of
attention. What first caught my ear, and I am extremely surprised no one else
mentioned this, was lead singer Liam Collingwood who sounds a LOT like David
Wayne from Metal Church. Not EXACTLY, you understand, but close enough in his
intonations and singing. And true to form, this band takes off like a ROCKET
with their first three tracks: CD opener 'Nightwalk' which portrays heavy riffs
right off the bat, 'Machination Factory' which slows the tempo down just a bit
but remains heavy and impressive nonetheless, and 'An Empty Glass' which blazes
away in a killer thrashy fashion. The guitar work often undertakes dark
overtones here as well, and these are three tunes that Metal Church would have
quite possibly had on one of their earlier albums, if we were in an alternate
universe. And that's my most favorite part of this 8 song affair folks.
Followup 'In The Distance' is a nice instrumental, and though I dig it, it also
points the way to the massive failure of this band. A not quite 3 minute
instrumental (which annoys me a bit by utilizing the last 30 seconds of quiet
rain noise) manages to creep it's way into the rest of the album. Let me
explain. Followup 'The Angel Of Rain' proceeds to continue on with said rain
sounds (okay, there's rain in the title) and melodic acoustic guitars to start.
Folks, already I miss the rockin' this band is capable of doing. This song being
almost 8 minutes long is definitely OVER indulgent with various moods, tempos
and time changes, and it's frustrating as hell. It's almost like the first three
songs never happened! Right when you get back around to some rockin' and killer
instrumentation, it drops the bottom right out. It does this about 6 or 7 times
in the length of the song. Okay, so now followup tune 'A Sacrifice' brings back
the heaviness and David Wayne like vocals, and at least is consistent from
start to finish. Not a bad tune, but it does sound rather familiar by this
point on the disc, and definitely NOT as good as the first three. Neither is
its followup 'Escape,' which is a straight forward speedy number, though the
riffing is weird and I can't really get into this tune. Most of what stands out
here is the lead soloing, which I must admit is quite accomplished all
throughout the disc. And the final travesty? The totally unnecessary 12 minute
CD ender 'The Fabled Uxoricide,' which starts out with melodic crooning yet
again, and of course jumps around all over the place yet again. It's like
they're afraid to get rocking again. Don't get me wrong, none of this is god
awful, but when you play like Metal Church, and you SOUND like Metal Church,
you EXPECT some thrashing heaviness to be present for the majority of the
disc. Still, with all that being said, the last few minutes of this CD ending
track do have some damn good jamming moments, but I have to sit through many
minutes of odd structure changes and to me the last half or so of this disc
sounds VERY subdued, as if they're afraid to break out and just kick ass.
Still, a decent first effort, but they are a band that needs MUCH decision
making to do if they plan on trying to be a potent force in the metal world.
Decide: Are you balladeers or kick ass metal rockers?
Contact: Medevil.
Somehow we missed this one awhile back, as it seems we no longer get servicing
from Northern Silence Productions any longer. Vicious Swedish black metal with
more than a handful of doom metal to go along, this is one kick ass and vicious
project. Right off the bat though, the first thing you need to know is you have
4 songs and a total running time of 48 minutes. Two 13 minute tracks, one 11
minute cut and CD ender 'Vordnad' at 9. Sadly, it's the CD ending track that
brings the score down a LOT farther than it should, though the first three cuts
are sheer excellence. We mentioned the doom metal which is ALL over the place
on this album. The guitar work on these first three cuts is what makes the disc
so damn fascinating, as they are completely masterful of being both a black AND
a doom metal band at the same time. Opener 'En Nyckel Till Drommars Grind'
shows you EXACTLY what you're in for. You know, their approach reminds me
greatly of that Spanish warlords Dantalion took on their first few albums. Nice
and slow, doomy guitar work with a unique mixture of melancholic and grim
atmosphere. They even throw in very subtle synthesized passages, which you
almost don't notice. Throwing a curveball, followup track 'Jag Fyller Min
Bagare Med Tomhet' cranks up the speed making this sound more like Nordic style
black metal. Of course, once the "lyrics" kick in, it's back to doom. I was
rather intrigued by the clean sung, almost ghostly torturous wailing that added
a new dimension to the proceedings and proves that mastermind E. Grahn (who
performs EVERYTHING on the album) is very versatile. No less can be said about
the music either, which takes turns punching through steel with speed and
blackened precision, or slowly creeping into your mind and body via the doomy
touch. It's quite varied for 2 13 minute tracks! Third cut 'Att Av Odets Tradar
Vava Sorg' goes back to blackened fast instrumentation, and this particular
track has probably the most melodic instrumentation of any cut on the disc, and
rather surprisingly so, utilizing many dark yet strangely melodic acoustic like
guitar work. And the clean sung vocals return once again, proving that Grahn
could indeed front a traditional doom project if he wanted to. Still, CD ender
'Vordnad,' though not terrible, utilizied a set of solitary acoustic like
guitar passages that did not grab me as well as everything else. There's about
5 minutes of this before the blackened shriek comes in, and then it continues
on for another minute and a half. The sick blackened vocal work is the main
highlight of this track, slow and doomy though it is. Sadly, the vocals are
quite short lived, making this 9 minute track fall a bit short of expectations
where the rest of the material is concerned. To be sure, it's a fine disc, but
3 out of 4 is barely a 75 or so; still there is much to enjoy on this disc and
I surely cannot wait for the next outing from Nasheim. Hopefully it's more than
4 tracks!!!
Contact: Northern Silence Productions.
It's amazing what a simple search will do to fling you far and away from where
you intended to be via the internet. As many know, we've been updating the
classic album section with actual band web info. Nightprowler to me was just
one German 80's metal band with a very rare 2 song EP from 1986. Until it was
revealed to me on the Encyclopaedia Metallum website that there was ANOTHER
band named Nightprowler, and they were from Ecuador. Well, holy shit! I don't
know of ANY bands from Ecuador, let alone one that plays blistering mixtures of
punk and proto 80's styled black metal! They kinda remind me of Speedwolf in
that their lead guitar work is rather unorthodox and comprises some NWOBHM
leanings alongside the raw punk vibe of a band like Toxic Holocaust. We'll skip
the rather silly opening "intro," of some strange moaning girl saying goofy
things about her master and Lucifer. Actually, I WILL mention that, now that I
think about it, that "girl" sounds an AWFUL lot like the woman who played the
lead role in that old T.V. series "I Dream Of Jeannie."
ANYWAY... Back to the fucking review. These guitars rock man... The vocal work,
well, some might not consider it black metal but it kinda does to me. They
bring the fury and venom courtesy of, well, old school Venom. They're kind of
echoed too, as if they're being shouted from a distance. Folks, this album
ain't gonna win any originality awards, but the 7 songs (minus the "intro," of
course) totally kill poseurs with power. There's a bit of speed, too, so plenty
of headbanging activity. Cuts like 'Drunk Whores And Destruction,' 'Midnight
Sacrifice, 'Hammer Of Horrors,' and 'Night Of The Prowler' should tell you
practically all you need to know. Some of the riffs do sound a bit
interchangeable after awhile (like 'Hammer Of Horrors,' the opening guitars
could be mistaken for those in 'Drunk Whores And Destruction,') but that's
really a minor complaint. Sometimes you just want a balls to the wall, face
ripping session with no intros, acoustic interludes, or silly spoken word
pieces that distract from the overall vibe you hope carries from start to
finish. In short, sometimes you just wanna bang your head and ROCK.
Nightprowler does that in spades. Oh, and 'My Boot Over The Face Of Christ'
has that Hellhammer/Voivod wierd kinda riff going on; sometimes it works, and
sometimes it don't, but overall this is the kinda black punk thrashing madness
you crave, at the end of a long and frustrating day. I enjoy this kinda band
over someone like Midnight anyday, and this CD sits quite nicely to the left of
albums by bands like Speedwolf, early Venom, and Toxic Holocaust; showing that
in this day and age, it's the blending of two or more genres of music that
brings out the smile to an old headbanger's face. I'm sure the horned one would
agree.
Contact: Midnight Sorcery Records.
I've been awaiting a new Nokturnal Mortum album for quite awhile now. We missed
out on "The Voice Of Steel," but absolutely adored "Weltanschauung." That was
over 13 years ago, and though I LOVE their earlier stuff like "Lunar Poetry,"
"Goat Horns" and "To The Gates Of Blasphemous Fire," I can't seem to get enough
of this newest release. First off, it must be said that this is definitely a
more folk oriented album, and the heavier guitar work seems to take a backseat
to the flutes, dulcimers, cellos and all sorts of manner of folkish
instrumentation. About the only thing left from their more blackened days is
the vocal work, but the blackened vocals are ALL over the place. I cannot
POSSIBLY go over the nuances of each and every track, because there is SO much
to digest from song to song, that it would take an entire magazine issue itself
just to detail so! But seriously, my only complaints are two: the odd tribal
intro that starts the album, and track 10: 'Black Honey.' That's it folks.
'Black Honey' bothers me for two reasons: One, the clean sung low toned vocals
are really odd, and the instrumentation is bouncy, kinda goofy and just not my
cup of tea. But everything else, holy shit! After the intro, 'Molfa' blasts
RIGHT outta the gate and is probably their fastest and most furious cut on the
record. Tribal, almost militaristic drumming adds a unique twist to probably
what is their closest (and on this disc, probably their only) attempt at the
old black metal days. Still, with the folk instruments all over the place, you
see where this is headed. My absolute alltime favorite track is 'Song Of The
Snowstorm,' fuck that atmospheric/ambient set of synths borders on space rock,
but this tune is absolutely EPIC. They add some interesting heavy twists here
too. I forgot to mention how some of their chanting vocals sound a bit Native
American on the 'Molfa' track too. There's a bit of a doom metal pacing to some
of their tunes, especially on 'Spruce Elder,' and later on down the disc with
the interestingly titled 'In The Boat With Fools.' Dark and haunting heaviness
can be found within 'Wolfish Berries,' and the CD could have ended very easily
with the amazing nine minute piece 'Night Of The Gods.' This track alone
carries the essence of EVERYTHING they've done on this disc to an epic and
fantastic conclusion; it's pure magic. The instrumentation has this weighty
gravity to it that just pulls you in; you almost forget you're listening to a
lengthy piece! Still, CD ender 'Where Do The Wreaths Float Down The River'
utilizes some rather light bell notes but FILLED with ambient landscapes; the
thunderous percussion roars a few times, but the essence of ambient nature
fills this CD's closing instrumental. Great for a drive through a deserted
forest filled highway (like the path to Mount Pisgah, for instance). This CD
will probably annoy the "black metal purists," but there's no denying that the
Ukranian horde has crafted such an amazing album; it took me about 10 or 15
complete spins to really "get" everything. Take some time with this one, as the
production is crisp and clear and allows everything to flow fully, but you'll
need many rotations to digest all that is. What a masterpiece!!
Contact: Oriana Music. (No website listed).
I remember two good 80's metal albums from Obsession, and I owned both of them:
"Scarred For Life" and "Methods Of Madness," the latter being more impressed
upon me than the former. So I know this album is about 5 years old, but it just
seems to me like it rather came out of nowhere. I didn't see many reviews on it
and I only happened upon it by chance when I was at ProgPower last year and saw
it in the Nightmare Records bin. So curiosity got the better of me and I picked
it up.
Right off the bat, lemme say that the overwhelming disappointment didn't hit me
immediately. Sure, I can detect a bit of a darker tone permeating some of the
cuts on the disc, but let me tell you; it doesn't often work in their favor.
And the choruses didn't strike me with the title track opening things up. It's
readily apparent that two things are an immediate standout from start to
finish, and that is Michael Vescera's unique singing voice, and those amazing
lead solos ALL over the damn place. So the first track didn't impress me, and
followup 'Twist Of The Knife' with it's faster start and okay choruses didn't
inspire confidence either. Something was missing, and the worst culprit was
track three 'Forbidden Desire,' hands down THE worst cut of the disc. Slower
and a bit more straightforward, with some really odd opening guitar framework.
The odd shouted multivocal pieces were unnecessary in my opinion, and the band
just DOES NOT DO the slow, haunting, dark and sinister thing well... At all...
SO, what DO they do well? 'When The Smoke Clears,' track number 4, is the
answer. Despite the acoustic start, the rockin' guitar work, the soaring vocals
and the less than dark tone gives rise to a more energetic and outstanding
track, which is what Obsession here excels at MUCH better. And those twin lead
solos here are awe-inspiring. 'License To Kill' follows, a much better effort
at bridging melody with a rather different approach to the song structure. I
oftentimes think this would be a good song to feature in a James Bond film.
THIS track is the lone exception to the rest of the somewhat darker fare that
plays to the strengths of Obsession's core principles, if you will. Keeping
things going, 'Wages Of Sin' is no slouch either, complete with catchy and
nice soaring vocal work on the choruses. The minimal instrumentation here plays
to accentuate Vescera's vocal work, and it's another highlight, as is the
followup 'Cold Day In Hell,' which chooses to add some speedier fretwork in
amidst the amazing high ended leads, making for an unusual contrast that, once
again, plays to the strengths of this band and the vocals add the heavy punch
that gives this track a life all it's own. Sadly, that's all you get, as the
last two tracks ('Mercy Killing' and CD ender 'Dark Shadows') fail to capture
much interest, aside from the flashy and quite skilled lead solos. The main
failure of this album is the "catering to the darkside" so to speak, and it's
not like it's an utter failure, but many times the choruses fail to spark an
interest; something that can drive the otherwise average mainlines into
something special. And though CD ender 'Dark Shadows' had a very interesting
set of instrumentation, it quite simply failed to deliver. Seeing as how their
previous album "Carnival Of Lies" came out 6 years before this one, and their
effort before that was 1987's "Methods Of Madness," I suspect they had plenty
of time to "tighten things up," as it were. Still, 4 songs out of a 10 track
affair; they can indeed do much better.
Contact: Inner Wound Recordings.
Unfortunately, I can't say as I'm all too familiar with Pagan Altar, even
though I DO have a CD copy of their "Volume One" disc. I must not have really
appreciated it at the time I got it, since it sits on a shelf with other CD's
that I "didn't get." To be honest with you, I don't even know what prompted my
interest in THIS album, but I may have gotten it from a digital download
service through Haulix or one of the others. Still, it's gonna make me go back
and revisit "Volume One," as maybe now I have more of an appreciation for the
late vocalist Terry, whose contribution definitely brings out the "old world
folk" influence that permeates this disc.
And to be honest, his delivery is a tad mournful and somber, though you can
hear traces of a somewhat southern dialect in the way he pronounces a few words
(like 'macabre' and others). The guitar work is outstanding, reminding me a great
deal of that NWOBHM "slight rock" alongside 70's rock and of course that doomy
folk touch. The most ominous thing about this record is the lyrical content,
complete with Satan's arrival, rotting dead breaking through the ground,
Vampires and Jack The Ripper. EVERYTHING about this album screams innovative
and quite different from anything else out there. Doomy opening guitar work on
CD opener 'Rising Of The Dead,' bright lead guitar work that rarely ever rages
out of control, and acoustic passages and near ballads are what's on display
here. One of my absolute favorite tracks is the folk story inspired 'The Room
Of Shadows,' (yes, the title track), with mainly acoustic guitars but man, in
the MIDDLE of this track the guitar work picks up tempo and ROCKS! Incidentally
on this cut, Terry showcases some SOARING vocal work; the absolute top shelf
BEST on the disc, and it's a goddamn shame he didn't rage like this on the rest
of the album. Even CD ender 'After Forever' (Don't think it's any relation to
the Black Sabbath song of the same name), with it's heavier acoustic guitar
work and more dynamic vocal work, is a treat. That being said, don't expect
ultra heavy instrumentation; these are songs that work in the doom metal frame.
Cut 'Jack The Ripper' raises some interesting questions lyrically, asking what
the motive for Jack's killings were since "there's nothing for him to steal. It
must be for what they know."
With all the great things there are to say about this, the songs are LONG:
'Jack The Ripper' itself clocks in at well over ten minutes, and besides lead
solos that blaze away with grace and skill (and actually are INTERESTING to
hear), there's not a whole lot of variety within the songs themselves. Still,
if that's not a bother, this is a fascinating listen, a bit more "laid back"
than you might expect, but not too many 70's rock/doom metal/folk inspired
tunes will you find expertly done. And Terry's vocals might be an acquired
taste for some, but I think this is a great record. Just sad that it's probably
THE last one.
Contact: Temple Of Mystery Records.
My history with Samael goes back a LONG way. "Ceremony Of Opposites" was the
first epic album I ever heard from them, and I was instantly hooked. The nasty
bite of the vocals, the heavily anti-christian stances in the lyrics, the
sinister keyboard passages from a guy who, live, NEVER moves behind the keys
onstage. When I saw them on Halloween of I think 1994, they impressed me
mightily. Then their two followups left me feeling a bit "betrayed," if you
will, though "Passage" was the better of the experimental "synth pop" stuff.
Fast forward to issue #37, when in an interview Vorph promised me that Samael
was heading "back to the roots," so to speak, with upcoming full length "Reign
Of Light." Imagine my surprise when that record didn't deliver the goods, so I
just went on to play "Ceremony," delve into their back catalog, and practically
ignored this band.
So I've missed a few albums down the path. However, when I saw the video for
their latest album, I thought "holy, HOLY shit! Is Samael back? For REAL this
time?" And lo and behold, Samael IS INDEED back. Now first off, I will say that
YES, I am aware there are still heavy keyboards here and probably some
electronic percussion as well. There's a very seriously dark, sinister and
militaristic vibe that permeates this disc and man is it every snarling, biting
and extremely vicious. YES, fuckers, Samael is INDEED back. Now, granted, I
know that further down the disc, the rather simplistic formula starts to sound
a bit "similar," shall I say (there are pieces of 'Black Supremacy' and
'Dictate Of Transparency' that are quite simply interchangeable), but who
fucking cares!?!? This to me SHOULD have been the logical followup to either
"Ceremony Of Opposites" or "Passage," and if Samael had continued down this
path, I might have remained a fan through those dismal years. The vocals
absolutely dominate everything here, as they should. And those lyrics are
quite intense. Take a line from 'Angel Of Wrath,' where you can feel the venom
dripping from lines like 'Blood Fire! Red Fire! Savior and Destroyer!'
Now granted, sometimes the synthesized electronic passages get a little weird.
They make the beginnings of a few songs almost cringeworthy (I'm talking about
'Red Planet' and 'Black Supremacy,' but also what made the bonus cut 'Storm Of
Fire' one of the weakest cuts on the disc. You probably don't have the version
with the bonus track, so no worries). Still, it's only a problem for a few
seconds. And I must say that including a Beatles cover of 'Helter Skelter' was
a REALLY odd choice, but goddammit if it didn't grow on me, because Samael made
it sound like THEY WROTE IT... The militaristic presence on here would make any
sane person hard pressed to believe this was a cover. Yes, the epic, bombastic
and overwhelming presence of the synthesized passages might be a turnoff to
some AT FIRST, but please give this a chance if you thought Samael didn't have
that aggressive blackened sickness down in there somewhere. Besides, it kinda
reminds me of the way Dimmu Borgir used synths to create a certain atmosphere,
but here Samael proves that the harsh, cold, and eerie electronica fits well
with black metal's aesthetics. I would even venture a guess that Euronymous
from Mayhem would surely approve of this, especially since Samael succeeded
beyond anyone's WILDEST dreams; far above and beyond even what Mayhem tried to
do with their "Grand Declaration Of War" album. Fantastic job, and welcome back
Samael!
Contact: Napalm Records.
Featuring two of the members of blackened thrash outfit Maax probably tells you
what to expect from this brand new group, and right off the bat lemme tell ya
if you loved Maax, the split with these guys now brings us TWO unholy rock and
rollers!! And that's not an inappropriate description, as the almost power
metal riffage is heavily accentuated by thrashy riffing, furious percussion
pounding, and the acidic death influenced raspy blackened vocals of Tim Green,
who also did time in Maax... So if the vocals sound a little familiar... Anyway
the disc starts off with some very interesting melodic like riffs, which I last
heard on the Japanese band Solitude's debut release... Still, 'Bow Down To
Death' opens up the disc nicely, well, except for the over-indulgence of
repetition of the song name throughout the end. NO END to the punishing guitar
work here. Slower and more eerie of a start follows up 'At The Sixth Foot,' and
it's quite a headbanging piece. 'M.P.F.F.' (which stands for Metal Punk Fight
Fuck) might sound a little odd lyrically but continues the punishing assault
with yet more thrashy riffs. Dark lead riffing permeates 'Whatever Demons,' but
to me the tune could have been a little bit stronger. Still, the last three
cuts close out the disc in furious, but interesting fashion, as 'Eternal Lies'
proves this isn't a one trick pony by utilizing both faster and slower riffing
and structure in the choruses themselves, though I was a little annoyed that
the rockin' comes to a stop for some lone acoustic guitar work (that probably
goes on a tad longer than it should, though it's dark), and 'She's Insane,'
lyrically, probably could have been called 'Crazy Bitch...' Still, those almost
power metal ROCKIN' guitars prove it's not all a speedy thrash fest. And our
little gem of a blackened thrasher closes out with pounding percussion and some
more of those almost too good for power metal rockin' riffs. This CD ender is
the shortest track on the disc, and the simplisticly short (lyric wise) but
simple choruses are memorable. Dig how they utilize a somewhat Running Wild set
of riffing to close out the track (and the disc), and I mean more modern, or
"recent" era Running Wild. Yes, it's sometimes surprising how melodic the
guitar work can be but make no mistake: Skeleton Wolf is awakening something a
bit unusual in blackened thrash land; still a bit too vicious and acidic to be
considered black 'n' roll, but the axemaster Brett Schlagel proves once again
that his talent is too vicious to be left behind since his departure from Maax.
I look forward to more!
Contact: Skeleton Wolf official website.
Man, it REALLY has been a long time since we caught up with the Japanese band
Solitude. We last reviewed their "Virtual Image" sort of EP release back in
2001, and here it is 14 years later when they unleashed their newest full
length. I was impressed by their "Virtual Image" album back then but an even
more blown away by this one. 8 tracks and nearly ALL of them scorching thrashy
masterpieces. With a bit of diversity that you might not expect from them! A
dark set of acoustic guitars lead the buildup on the opening track 'Venomous
Angel,' and for the next SEVEN tracks, the rockin' don't stop, the thrashin'
gets more and more intense, and I do believe these are some of the best
songs Akira has ever written! The drums pound furiously on this disc, and even
though a few tracks are long, he doesn't waste too much time closing the songs
out. Followup 'Blow' is one of the most intense songs here, bringing out an
unusual Motorhead meets NWOBHM flair to the guitar work. It's a fast and
rockin' affair folks! The cannon fire blasts at the end of the song accentuate
just how explosive this stuff is! Proving it's not all fast speed, there's some
REALLY nice melodic high ended guitar work opening up the title track, which
runs at a different pace but still manages to impress. The vocal work is
borderline death metal, with that Lemmy from Motorhead vibe he's always had
since day one. A somewhat melodic track that outright ROCKS. Another heavy
tune follows in 'Don't Need Mercy,'a faster cut that shows off Akira's
penchant for NWOBHM flair in his writings. Still even more surprising is how
Akira takes a somewhat Middle Eastern/Arabic set of almost thrashy guitar work
and STILL manages to make a punishingly heavy and frenetic affair! (Take note,
oh ye of the band Melechesh!) This makes 'On The Edge Of Sorrow' not only kick
ass and thrashing rock, but adds a very unique mysterious and eerie vibe to the
whole thing! And 'You Got My Mind' DEFINITELY will remind many of Motorhead.
Now the "bad." Well, it's not really BAD per se, but though I did enjoy the more
melodic and somewhat down tempo guitar work of CD ender 'December,' it's not
really among his best work. It DOES have that "late night kick back and chill
vibe while still rocking slightly" thing going for it, but at 8 minutes it gets
a little repetitive. Still, the two lead solo sections are something to see, as
he incorporates amazing guitar leads on EVERY turn. Akira is one of few guitar
players I know that will do blazing fast lead solos on one track, then slow
them down completely on another, as if he knows EXACTLY what type of lead solos
go with certain songs. Still, I must say when you have the first 7 tracks blaze
away with such power and precision, I have NO fucking idea just how you would
end an album like this.
OH! Damn... before I go, I forgot to mention THE most amazingly kick ass
instrumental song I have EVER heard from ANY band: 'Escape For The Crime.' This
short 3 minute instrumental kicks awesomely serious ass, better than ANY other
instrumental I have EVER heard. For months now I thought "shit, this is so
killer that it NEEDS good lyrics and sick, blackened vocals." SO... I obliged.
I wrote lyrics for it and did some long winded blackened screams and retitled
the song 'Ace Hellfire Batallions.' If you want to hear it, email me. This CD
kicks so much ass it inspired me to get off MY ass and do something. Fucking
thrash masterpiece of 2017 as far as I'm concerned...
Contact: Spiritual Beast Records.
After the brilliant "God Behind The God," The first Finnish doom metal band
does it yet again!! And sadly, I had thought no one would beat Arcana 13 for
best doom metal album of 2016, but here, right at the end of the year, it's no
surprise that it takes a heavyweight band like Mr. Witchfinder and crew to
leave the competition face down in the dirt... EVERY track on here is great,
from the more midtempo rockin' pace of opener 'Robe Of Ectoplasm,' to the more
melodic, beautiful and mournful CD closer 'World Of No Light.' Which, I might
add, closes the album off beautifully and in an epic fashion. Right from the
start of most songs, you can hear the heavy, dark and crushing doom, Mr. Albert
Witchfinder often playing the vocal chameleon portraying many different moods
and "auras," if you will. My complaints with this album are very few, and more
along the lines of a few individual occurrences than anything long lasting.
First off, on the cut 'Holiday In The Cemetery,' the opening low toned spoken
word play was a bit odd, but soon the track rights itself quickly. And my only
other minor complaint is on 'She Died A Virgin,' where Albert spends a bit too
much time on the long winded higher registered notes, which were a surprise but
just oddly drawn out. That and the over repetitive "no one saw her disappear"
line. But still, man, Spiritus Mortis has cranked a fucking masterpiece of epic
doomy proportions. Maybe I'm just too picky, but there's not one song I would
ever skip over. The timing of the songs was a great idea as well, as there are
only 2 songs that clock in at 9 minutes or longer, and they're spaced out
nicely alongside a 3 minute, a 4 minute, a 5, 6 and two 7 minute songs. Toying
with the idea of diversity, it's amazing to me that this band can create 8 epic
masterpieces that don't sound remotely like the other, and really I have
nothing more to say, except that it's a shame this is only available as an
expensive import from Finland. Still, it's worth every damn penny, and easily
crushes anything else for doom metal masterpiece of 2016.
Contact: Svart Records.
Even though this album is a 2015 release, it's still a revelant "recent"
release from a long standing NWOBHM band... Actually, since new singer ZP
Theart is such a versatile cat, this band is able to play around with quite a
few styles and sounds... If you're expecting the gritty, hard and heavy mixture
that brought about such albums as "Power Of The Hunter" and "This Means War,"
you're thinking in the wrong direction. However; if you, like myself, fancied
the energetic and catchy rockin' Tank experimented with briefly on the album
"Honour And Blood," then you'll definitely be in the right mindset to
appreciate this album. Actually, this release surprised me, as I felt Doogie
White was a little underdeveloped and not QUITE the man to pull off the job, as
the 2010 album "War Machine" left me quite disappointed, and even kept me from
checking out "War Nation," the 2012 followup. I read in an interview where the
band felt new vocalist ZP brought new life to the table, and allowed Tank to
experiment with more hard rock styles of songs. Still, MY interest was piqued
when I learned that ZP had sang before with none other than DragonForce for
almost 10 years!
Let's get to the meat of the album. First of all, the emotionally soaring title
track starts this album off amazingly, and is probably one of the best tunes on
the record. It has this kinda melancholic atmosphere to it but still retains a
rockin' edge, complete with almost thrashier guitar work, which surprised me
that Tank has this much multi dimensionality! Followup 'War Dance' keeps the
metal flowing, and is still energetic. One of my favorite tunes is the cut
'World On Fire,' ending choruses being a tad overrepetitive, but what has to be
considered one of the heaviest cuts on the disc. And 'Make A Little Time'
showcases a little more of a hard rock edge, but still with a somewhat heavier
NWOBHM flavor. It's your standard "rockin' and partyin'" anthemic track.
'Heading For Eternity' has the most amazing soaring vocal work, another great
highlight to a disc that showcases heavier edged music while proving that even
though it's NWOBHM/Hard rock laced, it's much too epic and full to be
considered a band that SOUNDS like it came straight out of the 80's. These are
songs that we all knew Cliff "The Riff" Evans is capable of writing.
That being said, it's not ALL picture perfect. There is not one crappy song on
the record, however it must be said that even the worst of tunes on here suffer
NONE from ZP's performance; in fact the track 'Eye Of A Hurricane' would be
quite lackluster if not for ZP's performance; he raises the bar for all the
cuts here and even manages to add additional life to cuts where they were
lacking. The same can be said for 'Living A Fantasy,' but once again, ZP is the
man who makes these few cuts better than they actually are. I questioned
closing out the album with an instrumental, in 'One For The Road,' as there
isn't much variety, and Tank (under Cliff Evans, that is) is capable of closing
out an album in an epic fashion; they pretty much proved this with "Honour And
Blood's" track 'Kill.' It's amazing to me that Tank is still alive, despite the
band being split into two different factions, but the fact that Tank has
mutated and evolved into a band capable of marrying three different styles of
music into a seamless machine... Well, that is indeed the true power of a Tank.
Contact: Metal Mind Productions.
Throes Of Dawn is definitely no stranger to our publication. Heri has
graciously recorded radio promo spots AND done an interview with us quite some
time ago (issue #50), and it's odd that we missed this newest release. We
reviewed "The Great Fleet Of Echoes" in this album and were pleasantly
surprised just how Pink Floyd'ish it was, and how the metal was still there.
But with this newest release, some 6 years later, nearly all the aggressive
elements have been removed entirely; still, this remains one of their strongest
and most amazing bodies of work. First off, damn, the amazingly epic and
emotionally charged guitar work is ALL OVER the place; in fact it's hard to say
what my two favorite instrumental pieces are, let alone one! I'd have to say
that Heri must have reached down VERY deep to pull at the heartstrings for this
one. I am sad that I didn't discover this when it came out, as right now I can
say it's one of my alltime favorite records of 2016 (and there were a LOT of
great album that came out that year). Synths fade in on the opening track
'Mesmerized,' and the slow build up is a great way to start the album. Throes
Of Dawn doesn't do ANYTHING in a hurry, and the dreamy buildups mean slightly
long song running times. Bordering on doom metal length for ALL the songs, it
means you have a lot to take in, and trust me when I say Heri varies things up
from minute one to the last on each song. One thing that did stand out to me
was how effective the "aaaah's" multichant vocals are and he uses them a LOT.
'We Used To Speak In Colors' starts right off with pianos and drums, and there
is a bit of melancholic "rockin'" to be found within. Emotionally charged
choruses are the norm here, and you'll be singing this stuff for DAYS. One of
my favorite cuts is 'Lifelines,' the minimal instrumentation accentuates Heri's
extremely simple yet powerful delivery and buildup; almost ballad like but once
the "heaviness" kicks in (and I have to use quotes on heaviness, since on this
album it takes on an entirely different meaning from EVERY other album that
utilizes heaviness), it's stunning. Expertly crafted, with one of the most
AMAZING lead solo work on the disc, just ungodly man! Followup 'The
Understanding' is DEFINITELY no slouch either, and also contains some of the
best fucking lead work on the disc. It's like magic, and these guitar passages
you swear you never want to end. The title track follows with an unusual
pairing: mostly bass guitar and atmospheric synths amongs somewhat low toned
vocals, almost eerie in nature. Still, the soaring choruses and eventual
"heaviness" keep you in there. Now, for the slightly bad: I almost wasn't sold
on the ultra melodic 'One Of Us Is Missing' track, with the kinda toybox notes
and kinda sappy ballad like delivery, though the lyrics are somewhat sad and
melancholic in nature, however that didn't stop me from enjoying a track that
does a complete 180 turn by the 5 minute mark. And here, there's some AMAZING
saxophone work, reminiscent of Pink Floyd's greatest work, while those killer
"aaaah's" help close this tune out. And further, CD ender 'The Black Wreath Of
Mind' at first seemed a bit too long at 14:24. Still, having said that, though
the bruising heaviness is gone, the dark and eerie vibes are NOT, this being
THE darkest cut on the disc, complete with ominous piano notations. However,
the country twanging guitar work was a bit too much, though fortunately this
doesn't last long, and the last 5 minutes of this track are sheer heaven.
After awhile the length of this cut grew on me, as Heri has a way of sneaking
up on you and entrancing you to sleep while rocking out and gently bringing you
back down from the clouds. I still miss the blackened days of "Binding Of The
Spirit" and "Pakasherra," but dammit, I have to say this is indeed Throes Of
Dawn's FINEST hour, and a disc that I am surprised I love so much. As a
footnote, I gave a copy of this disc to a Romanian friend at work who doesn't
speak the best of English, but thought this disc was stunning. And so it is.
Welcome back Throes Of Dawn, you've been away FAR too long, but this more than
makes up for the 6 year absence. I daresay this would have been worth a TWELVE
year wait.
Contact: Argonauta Records.
First off, I have to provide a "definition," if you will... Anyone who has even
the remotest interest in the New Wave Of British Heavy Metal Movement should be
familiar with this term, which I will call the "Def Leppard Syndrome." This is
an extremely important term, as it (to me) defines what ruined most of the
brightest and greatest bands in the NWOBHM era. It has plagued NWOBHM bands in
the 80's, still plagues them in this recording day and age, and even had it's
effects reach farther than the United Kingdom (or Britain, Great Britain, etc.)
ever intended. It is described as the bands in Britain who were envious of the
massive success that Def Leppard achieved when they "went to America." Becoming
multi millionaires with gold and platinum album sales, it dramatically changed
the style and sound of many of these bands, almost overnight, and with mostly
abysmal records and even more disappointing results. Nearly every one of these
bands faded into obscurity. Even in Sweden, the results were felt as some bands
that had a few albums under their belts changed their sound.
Now, to be fair, the NWOBHM wasn't ALWAYS categorized by bands playing straight
forward heavy metal. In fact, many of the earliest NWOBHM bands are
disqualified from being listed in the Encyclopedia Metallum AKA the Metal
Archives for not being "metal enough." Many of these bands' removals are
argued by myself, but whatever. More recent attempts by some NWOBHM bands (like
the latest from Tank) to mix NWOBHM, heavy metal and more "accessible" stadium
styled rock (AOR if you will) have been quite successful, breathing fresh and
diverse life into a genre that has always been celebrated but very late to the
"revival" stage. Then we have Tygers Of Pan Tang.
Now, I haven't heard any Tygers albums post "Wild Cat" and "Spellbound," but I
HAVE heard that they progressed farther and farther away from anything "metal"
since then. Dunno. However, I was impressed by their mixture of catchy, arena
styled hard rock and more melodic NWOBHM leanings on about 5 tracks of this 11
song near disaster. Let's start with the good, and briefly: The first two
tracks absolutely ROCK. Opener 'Only The Brave' reminds me of the path Tank
took recently, and great to start off with an explosive number. Catchy soaring
vocals, choruses and rockin' guitar work, a heavier take on the NWOBHM sound
than I think they've ever done. Followup 'Dust' has an almost hard rock flavor
entirely, but gets the job done. Down and dirty is the direction for 'Never
Give In,' showcasing great diversity by being a fast tune, and I daresay is
probably one of their darkest, heaviest and most aggressive tunes they've EVER
penned in their entire careers. There's a bump in the road before the cut 'Do
It Again,' again with soaring vocals and catchy choruses and melodies. Finally,
track 9 'Blood Red Sky' is the last rockin' cut you'll hear on this disc, which
has a REALLY hard rock vibe to it and dammit if this doesn't sound like a Saxon
tune, our lead singer strangely channeling Biff Byford throughout the beginning
of this track. And that's it folks, a mere 5 songs that barely make this worth
the effort, when you have two "ballads," and a godawful train wreck called
'Glad Rags,' complete with twangy southern rock stupidity and the dumbest
lyrics this side of the Mason-Dixon line. And the "cover" of 'I Got The Music
In Me?' Lyrically, I understand the significance of a song like this, but it
should have never been done. And what metal band in their right mind would EVER
say "I feel funky?!" This ain't soul music, man! Finally, you would think CD
ender 'The Devil You Know' would be a rockin' track, and it tries, but
unfortunately our southern roots crooner prefers to sing in an odd, low toned
drawl that makes this a heavier tune that sadly doesn't cut the mustard. The
choruses are weak too, which is a surprise considering how well this band does
with heavier material. If they'd cut out the damn fluff, and stop trying to
"cash in" on Americana mainstream radio, this would have been a surprise hit;
just look at the heavier tunes to see what this band is truly capable of. So
please, stop giving in to the "Def Leppard Syndrome..." Please, for the love of
heavy music and all that is (un)holy, just fucking stop it now... NOW!!!
Contact: Mighty Music.
Damn... What DO they put in the water in Salt Lake City, Utah? 'Cause if the
monstrous Caladan Brood (who scored one of our highest scores EVER in the
history of the magazine) wasn't enough to whet your appetite, now comes power
metal's biggest powerhouse in recent years. This album, every song is amazing.
EVERY goddamn song. Headbanging riffs, great singalong choruses, catchy guitar
work, that "epic" feeling that tells me maybe there's a Caladan Brood member in
there somewhere, and yes, there IS a Gallowbraid member (which I must admit is
yet ANOTHER amazing band from Salt Lake City). This band is bursting with
talent no doubt, and it bleeds metal over EVERY track on the record. The cover
of Manilla Road's "Necropolis" was a great choice, and sadly for me I heard the
cover first before I got around to hearing the "Crystal Logic" album that bears
this amazing track. The title track opens things up, with some kinda "crunchy"
guitars coming in. 'Dungeon Master' is another great tune, filled with epic
choruses and even some blazing lead solos. A tribute to all those who took on
the title of Game Master in those epic late night D&D sessions. 'Mammoth Rider'
comes close to bringing the doom tempo, and varies things up significantly.
It's a warriors prayer if you will. And the clean sung passages? Almost ballad
like but not syrupy. 'Blood Sacrifice' contains some acoustic guitars and clean
sung vocal work that goes more for an epic and emotional feeling rather than
catering to the "love ballad." Some absolutely BEAUTIFUL guitar work is
contained within, an interesting yet eyebrow raising feature on lyrical matter
that is extremely dark and rather occult laced. 'Iron Brotherhood' is one of my
alltime favorites, complete with epic multivocal choruses, a tune that will
make your heart burst with pride at being one of the true metal warriors. And
listen to those bass guitars chug! 'Vengeance' has a bit of tempo and structure
changes to keep things interesting, while the amazingly epic and sorrowful
ending proves Visigoth to be a master at painting with different colors and
brush strokes. A tune like this makes the canvas appear like a non-entity!
'Creature Of Desire' sounds like one of those somewhat cheesy 80's metal
rockers, and it's an obvious nod to the strength and power of 80's traditional
metal, done with class and a lot of heart. CD ender 'From The Arcane Mists Of
Prophecy' is almost 10 minutes long, and sometimes may seem a bit TOO long, but
the mastery of song and story continues, and behold the amazing funeral doom
touch near the tune's end. Though most of the album is a bit "lighthearted,"
which may seem an insult to their mastery, THIS track contains some of the
darkest instrumentation on record. Folks, this is a power metal masterpiece for
sure, with Jake Rogers singing with heartfelt intensity, power and emotion,
never once trading a strong delivery for cheesy high pitched power metal yawls!
He doesn't need them, and the rest of the band turns in a solid performance...
It's damn hard to say which two albums get power metal's best performance this
issue; Helstar's newest or Visigoth's, suffice it to say that Visigoth are an
absolutely amazing band and I dare say this would be an excellent band to see
live. Salt Lake City turns out the masterpiece records yet again. How will they
top this one?
Contact: Metal Blade Records.
CIRITH UNGOL.
Interview with Rob and Tim via phone.
Need I say more? This interview was a little difficult to conduct, but
suffice it to say this band is one I've been after for an interview for a VERY
long time. And of course, the "One Foot In Hell" album was indeed the 1000th
title to be incorporated into the classic album archives at the Vibrations Of
Doom compound. You're into metal, you KNOW about this band, so let's just jump
right into what is unarguably a feature interview in ANY music magazine!
(This interview starts out with a little history lesson from Rob)
Hey Steve, lemme tell you something you'll crack up at, this is kind of
historic and ironic. We're actually playing in a room where we recorded the
drums for "Paradise Lost," but me and Tim are sitting in the room where we
recorded "King Of The Dead," "Frost And Fire," and "One Foot In Hell," the old
studio. And what happened was the guy still has the studio, but he's touring
all over the world with other big bands and stuff, but the studio kinda sits
idle for awhile. So it made perfect sense for us to kinda come back to where we
actually started. We could throw a rock from where we're sitting and hit our
old band room. We're back in the studio where it all began.
- Right on. It's kinda funny because the first album I ever heard
from you guys was "One Foot In Hell." And to me that was just a rockin' album.
You know, I was young back then...
Tim: So were we. (laughs).
- Absolutely... But I was in high school listening to that record.
And a lot of people I played that for, unfortunately I heard stuff like "ah,
well, the guitar playing, the songs rock" but they couldn't get past the voice
and I was like "fuck y'all, the voice is perfect."
Rob: Yeah, we've heard that a lot over the years; it's always been a hit or
miss thing. It is what it is. If you wanna tell true stories, though, there's a
buddy of mine from Canada, he said "hey, there's this band Rush you gotta go
check out right?" So we went down to L.A. and saw them at The Whiskey, and there
was like no one there, just a few people and the guys in the band. We actually
went backstage to meet them. But I mean no one's there, no one's heard of them,
there's no photos posted on facebook...
Tim: (sounding somewhat mocking) "They have a funny voice!"
Rob: So we get back home and I'm playing the record for people and they're
going "Oh my god, that guy's voice sucks!" A lot of people said that, but they
turned into some megagroup. We were friends with them for years, we only lost
touch with them after we reached some level... it's kinda hard to...
Tim: But anyway, let's get going with the interview here! (laughing here)
Rob: Yeah, no, no, but the other part of the story is, when we get to write all
our fan mail and some guy wrote us a fan letter like he said "Man, I bought
your album (it was probably "Frost And Fire" or "King Of The Dead") man, your
singer sucks so bad; I like your band but your singer is horrible." You know,
we sit there and answer fan mail three or four nights a week after band
practice. And we are trying to like get in touch with whoever is listening to
our music. Anyway, two or three weeks later we get a letter, and we didn't
realize it was the guy until we read it, but he said "I'm the guy remember I
said you guys sucked, I've been listening to the album, and you guys are like
my favorite band in the world now.
Tim: It's like when you're a kid and you drink beer for the first time, and you
don't like it, but it becomes an acquired taste.
- It's STILL an acquired taste... (laughing here)...
Rob: This is what's funny; at that show we played the other night, we read two
or three reviews, not just one, that Tim sounded better now than he did on the
albums!
- Wow. I wanted to ask you about that reunion show, because for a
long time, a lot of people thought that would never happen. Of course, it's
really a shame that Jerry Fogle is no longer with us. But fast forward to 2016,
everybody's like "Wow, Cirith Ungol, they're back together and they're touring
again!" I think a lot of people are still in shock that that's actually
happening.
Rob: Well, we're not actually touring, we're just doing selective things. It
was just a twist of fate where everything came together perfectly to decide
to get back together and play some more. It took a long time to get
everything together. And it was about time to do it; it's been fun so far. It
was awesome; the turnout and everything, the support from the fans over the
years.
Plus a couple of promoters in Europe, and also Jarvis here in our hometown,
they've been emailing me... I'm not saying I'm the guy that caused this to
happen, but I was the guy that swore I'd never touch another drumstick as long
as I live! (laughs) I got so burned out from the music industry.. We were together
for 20 years and even though I thought we did some great stuff... here it feels
like you're swimming upstream but you're swimming up the Niagra Falls, that's
how it felt to us.
So Jarvis, the bass player of Night Demon for three or four years kept bugging
me "hey man, you gotta get back together, go to Europe, and everyone's wearing
Cirith Ungol shirts and they love your band," and every year I'm like "Nope,
nope, nope!" (laughing here). And then we put on this festival last year and
like 1200 people came from all over the world and we sat there and did a meet
and greet, signed autographs, and met some of these fans. First off, they're
all under 30, second, they're like half girls, and the third thing is everyone
knew every one of our songs. A lot of people are going to misinterpret this,
you've read some reviews that said "oh yeah now they're getting together only
because there's money there." That had nothing to do with it! In fact, I have a
drum set and if I played for 10 more years it wouldn't even break even on the
drum set I have now.
But the reason we got together, was the look in these kids' eyes. When I say
kids, they're kids compared to us. But also, the pressure from people who said
"Hey look, if you get together you know, you can play... Oliver offered to fly
us over to Keep it True, and me and Tim went there last April. And it was just
unbelievable... Everyone there knew who we were. There were thousands of people
who knew me and Tim, even though we've aged a little bit. They knew, I mean in
the middle of the night they knew who we were, in the dark! (much laughter
here!) If this many people really like the band, why should we withhold the
music from them? I know that sounds kinda idealistic and weird, but that's the
real reason we're together is because people actually wanna hear us.
- So it's not all the girls that started getting into the band again?
(laughing here).
Rob: Naw, no. (didn't sound too sincere here - Ed). It doesn't hurt, but no.
- Europe's got a LOT of them. And they love metal.
Tim: Not like here! (laughs).
- Well, there's some here too, it's scattered. And that's the
realistic thing about trying to tour the States. It's such a massive country
and it's really hard to pinpoint the areas where the biggest concentration of
fans are. Everybody says "oh, L.A., you gotta go to New York." The New Wave Of
British Heavy Metal band Satan played here last weekend and it was so packed in
there you couldn't even move. People were shouting "Satan! Satan!" after EVERY
song they played. It was in a little tiny club, kinda looks like a hole in the
wall; the sound guy is in a closet basically. But they were saying they've done
four shows and that was the best show they've done; they couldn't see how the
rest of the tour would even stack up!
Tim: Yeah, yeah. Actually went down and saw that, they were doing a little tour
around here with Night Demon, our friends in Night Demon. It was over at the
Roxy in L.A. It was the same thing there, they cram the club there, it was
Satan, Night Demon and a couple of other bands. It was pretty cool; they got
the same reaction there. Like you said, it's like small pockets around the
country where there's like diehard metal fans. It's not like it's fully
concentrated on New York or L.A. or something; there's plenty of places where
there's clubs, and lots of things are happening. You gotta hit the right spots
and the right clubs if you're a metal band trying to make a living I guess.
Rob: Well, there's some reviews on this show that we just played, which were
positive, but also too overall on the whole festival (Frost And Fire fest -
Ed.) a lot of guys were saying it's one of the best festivals they've ever been
to, plan wise. It's like a block from the beach, beautiful weather. Down town
Ventura, there's like a hundred different restaurants, so anything you'd want
to eat, you're within 5 minutes walking distance. But, I gotta comment on this,
when we're doing the meet and greet the next day, people came all the way from
Leningrad, Russia and from China to see the band, and yet there's maybe like a
handful of people from L.A. and maybe 2 people from our hometown. So a thousand
people flew from all over the world to see us and yet people we know couldn't
even walk a block...
Tim: Well, that's how it is, you know, nobody in your home town gives a shit
about you anyway. That goes with any band anywhere.
- Well, I've often heard an old saying that says a prophet is often
revered anywhere but in his hometown. But Atlanta is like that too, though
local Atlanta thrashers Sadistic Ritual they're a killer thrash band. A lot of
times they'll pack the shows, other local bands, some people can't be bothered.
But nowadays, a lot of us have jobs, and families and responsibilities.
Especially if shows are during the week, it's really hard to do those. But a
festival, that's something you take time off for. (laughing here).
Tim: That's a killer man, like in the middle of the week. And I go "Oh, I'd
really like to go see them, oh, it's on a wednesday, Aw, I gotta get up at like
5 in the morning!" (laughing.)
- We gotta see about getting you guys over here to Atlanta, there's
always like ProgPower... I'm surprised you haven't been contacted by ProgPower,
because that thing in Atlanta sells out every year that it's put on. That's a
festival that they announce the bands a year in advance, I'm sure if Cirith
Ungol were to play that, it would sell out at the first mention of it.
Rob: We have heard of that festival, yeah. So... I dunno if we'd had any
contact with them yet, or whatever. We know people that are involved in it.
We'd really like to do that. We do have a couple of things that are booked for
next year (which, 2018 is already here - Ed). We're working on other stuff in
the near future, and that's a possibility. I've heard that's a really good
festival, and it's actually getting to be not quite the prog thing; they're
doing a lot more metal and things like that. I've heard it's really nice,
successful and really cool.
- They really go out on a limb. We went this year (2017 - late ass Ed
again), and some of the after parties are notorious! You haven't lived until
you've tried Vodka soaked gummy bears (laughing). Fates Warning's 30th
anniversary of "Awaken The Guardian," they played that in it's entirety, and
when they announced that tickets sold out in I think like nine hours. I could
see Cirith Ungol as like a huge, heavy hitter for this thing.
Tim: Yeah, they actually did the same thing at Keep It True last year; Rob and
I were over there. Yeah, things like that, the classic metal bands like you
know, Fates Warning, Manilla Road, Omen, all those kinds of bands that do all
the festivals and stuff; all the guys that I talked to said they agree, they
really have a great time and it's all about the fans and having fun.
- Now, I wanted to go all the way back to 1979, when you guys put out
that self titled demo. I just kinda wanted to get your thoughts on that: here
you guys are, you're a brand new band, you're kinda just starting around. What
was going through your head at the time; did you ever think that this band
would be doing shows and playing 30 years later?
Tim: We didn't really put out a "demo" demo, our first demo was "Frost And
Fire." That was never supposed to be a general release to the public; that was
supposed to be a demo for us to shop around and try to get a record deal.
Because everybody else at the time was sending out cassettes... I don't know if
anybody reading this knows what a cassette used to be (laughing here). Everbody
was sending cassettes to record companies and they'd throw them in the trash,
or they'd tape over them with their kid's play stuff. So we decided to make a
record to show the record companies what we could do and what it would look
like and things like that. Then it just kinda steamrolled into getting
released. It's a long story and somewhat well known; I don't wanna get into it
here.
Rob: I think where you might be getting confused, Steve, since the band broke
up there's been a long history of bootlegs coming out. The only other thing we
did before "Frost And Fire," we put out... They call it the orange cassette.
And some of that stuff ended up on "Servants Of Chaos," like some of the early
songs that Tim sang on like 'High Performance,' 'Last Laugh,' stuff like that.
But that was a cassette that we were trying to do the same thing. We were
sending this out to all the record companies, and we'd never get a response or
anything. So we thought, if we do a record and we get good artwork, good
photographs; you know, do a proper recording. That way when we hand that to
someone...
And what's really funny, we were probably the first band to do that... Not
ever, but during that era. Then right after we did it, then the Motley Crue's,
Metal Massacre I, Brian put out his first thing on his own record label. We
were the first band in L.A. to actually put out a record that was completely
self produced and paid for by the band. The funny thing about that was, people
say "hey, did you get any air play?" Well, there's a big local, kinda hard rock
station in L.A. and on Monday night they played new bands or whatever. We sent
them the album and they played 'I'm Alive' and 'Frost And Fire.' We're all
sitting around the radio listening to it, we're all excited. Then the next day
I talked to the guy and he goes "man, that's way too heavy for us to play!"
(MUCH laughter here).
- Wow.
Rob: I mean, this is the station that's playing Black Sabbath, Deep Purple or
whatever. That's where we kinda decided to do "King Of The Dead." All the songs
off "Frost And Fire" were written by Greg, and we had a bunch more songs that
we all wrote together. But he tended to write songs that were more, we
thought had more commercial... Like if people listen to them like 'Edge Of The
Knife,' or 'Better Off Dead' or something.
Tim: It was a big cross section of stuff we were doing. Just to show people
what we could do. Our heavy stuff, our not so heavy stuff, instrumentals, the
whole thing. It's just a weird thing.
- I'm looking at the track listing for the orange album, and you see
a song like 'High Speed Love,' 'Route 666,' and 'We Know You're Out There.'
Rob: that's a bootleg tape. Like I said we just put a cross section of all that
stuff on "Frost And Fire." They're all about or around that time though.
Tim: are you looking at an album?
- (Laughing heavily here) Oh, I wish!
Tim: The thing you're talking about, is it an LP?
Rob: No, no he's looking at a track list and it's probably online you're
looking at it right?
- You know, it's amazing that there's so much information online.
Rob: Oh my god, we did an interview with a guy in Poland last week, and he knew
our underwear sizes! (MUCH laughter here). Matter of fact, he was asking so
many pointed and detailed questions that were semi-secret... Well, not secret
but not well known.
Tim: You have to dig through like all kinds of interviews to find these
references to some of the stuff he was asking, which was really weird. This guy
must have like a private investigator tracking us down or something.
Rob: He knows so much about us, why did he have to ask us any questions? He
knew everything that no one else knew, it was kinda funny.
- I kinda do things a little differently in the interviews... You can
only ask the same music related questions 30 - 40 thousand times. On the other
end of the spectrum, these are people with ideologies, and philosophies and
things like that. There's so much more beyond just the music. You wanna know
about the music, you can listen to the music or you can read the lyrics.
There's so many interesting things to talk about, and I think a lot of music
magazines miss that.
I've been doing Vibrations Of Doom for 25 years, and I just got to the point
where, yeah, it's cool to read about how somebody recorded an album and things
like that. You start talking about lyrics, you start getting into kind of a
deeper ideology that I think a lot of publications miss the opportunity for,
you know what I'm saying?
Tim: We had a thing in the local paper here, right before the last festival,
and the guy's been doing it for like 20 - 30 years also. And he got to the
point where all he does is turn a tape recorder on and ask a question, and then
just types up the thing. He doesn't go through and go "oh, this is what he
meant," He doesn't go through and...
Rob: Analyze it...
Tim: No, not analyze, but you know, just write whatever the hell you say and
just put it on paper. Taking no time and no effort behind it. I'm kinda glad
you said that because that kinda give us confidence. It was weird reading those
off the cuff remarks and the guy just put them in there...
Rob: A lot of times I say dumb shit! (much laughter here from everyone)
Tim: I don't wanna print that out loud, but Rob will talk off the top of his
head and say "hey this is off the record," but the guy would actually print it
"hey this is off the record but blah, blah, blah. " You read that and you're
kinda going "hey, that was supposed to be off the record." You're not supposed
to print that and put the comment in there, you know!
- You know, it's one of things a lot of people talk about, and I hate
to use this word with you guys, but a lot of people talk about the "classic"
bands, whether it be metal or rock. And how these bands will get back together
and everyone will go "Aw, you know, I remember those hits" and everything. But
they "well, we got some new stuff," and it seems like nobody wants to hear
those new songs. They get stuck in nostalgia, but the true fans are the ones
that are gonna want to go "hey, new album, I took it and I listened to it for
3 hours or whatever and there's some great songs on it." It's kinda like a
double edged sword, you know?
Tim: You're right about that. I feel the same way when I go to see bands. You
go to see a band and you're like "aw, man they're playing those three or four
songs, why didn't they play those three or four from back in the day that are
so much better." I mean, you kinda gotta move along; hopefully the stuff that
we're gonna be doing in the future is gonna back up everything that we've done
in the past. I don't think anyone's gonna have a problem with that. We wouldn't
do it if we didn't think it was up to whatever standards, or low standards we
may have (laughing here) for ourselves. We'll just integrate it with the
classics of course when we go out and play.
Rob: Plus, our style is so unique and weird, you know. Between my completely
unorthodox drumming style and Tim's voice, and Greg wrote a lot of our songs
in the band. Our stuff is gonna be so weird that people are gonna like it. Who
would say "I don't wanna hear 'Black Beast Of Blood.' (laughing here).
Tim: I don't wanna get too crazy, but we probably have 20 songs that were never
recorded, or recorded right... We're gonna be pretty selective about what we
do, but we'll probably throw something old in there and redo it.
- I was kinda curious, I remember for a lot of people, especially
people that got into the band a lot earlier than I did. And like I said, "One
Foot In Hell" is my favorite album. It's just where I was at the time. I think
where I was at the time... This is gonna sound weird. I probably wasn't mature
enough at the time to appreciate all the things that were going on with "Frost
And Fire" and "King Of The Dead." You know, because you do have the progressive
elements. I like the extended instrumental jam sessions. You've got a LOT of
doom metal influence over there which people completely overlook when it comes
to Cirith Ungol. And then you've got these guitars, which sounded like they
were recorded in the 70's. Like that vintage, warm, kinda... I don't know how
to describe it but that analog sound, you know what I'm saying? And that's
where I was at with your whole discography.
Didn't get to hear "Paradise Lost," unfortunately, but that's one I'm going to
have to track down.
Tim: Those are jam songs too, like 'War Eternal' and 'One Foot In Hell.' Yeah,
you know, that's a great album too; I know what you're saying; it was just more
straight ahead than the other ones I think. I think what you mean as far as...
And more straight ahead like kind of a metal record instead of a little bit
more progressive or whatever you want to say. I don't know about... In the doom
thing, we've been called everything from the godfathers of epic doom metal to
the worst heavy metal band that ever existed. So, you know, we're somewhere in
between... Somewhere in between lies the truth. We take it all as just an honor
to even be mentioned, and glad that people still wanna hear us and see what we
are doing.
Rob: It's amazing also too that the people know our songs. I told this story to
one of the other guys, when we were over at KIT (Keep It True - Ed.) it was
really dark, we were over at the back of this building, 1 o'clock in the
morning, these guys with leather jackets, chains... They seemed like a pretty
rowdy group. They were very drunk, and I looked at Tim like this is gonna
either end very badly or we were gonna make it through this right? We get up to
them and they turn around and they point and they go "Tim Baker." This was one
in the morning, nobody even had a cell phone light, right? It's just like dark
like you were in an alley. They recognized me and they busted into singing
'Frost And Fire' word for word! And this was our first night in Germany, and I
was like "oh my god!" So we thought we were gonna get beat up and they ended up
like hugging us!
- So where do you see the new album going stylistically? Do you have
any lyrics, song titles or teasers you could throw at us? (laughing). Now
you've got me all excited for a new Cirith Ungol album.
Tim: We're working on tracks in here, stuff worked up into our set. We're
not giving it a timetable for anything new. We can't really be giving away
anything like that. I've written tons of lyrics, we have that down. Hopefully
it will be in the not too distant future.
Stylistically, we want it to be representing Ungol. We've progressed from "King
Of The Dead," "One Foot In Hell" and that kinda stuff. We want it to be along
the same lines... Heavy!
Rob: We were talking to the guys in Rush and Alex once said "I wanna make the
heaviest music that we can." And I remember the next album was "2112" and I
really liked that. But if you listen to their things; and they're fantastic
musicians, but they kinda got into more experimental, progressive music. But
I wanna kick it down into the gutter. I wanna take this stuff...
Tim: I want it to be more doomy...
Rob: Yeah... If you listen to "Frost And Fire" and "King Of The Dead" our
answer was if that's too heavy, well look, THIS is our heavy shit. I wanna put
out something that makes "Frost And Fire" looks like, kinda like a children's
lullaby.
- Wow...
Tim: I wanna do something that's so heavy that guys go "wow." We're
gonna have to have a parental label on the thing... (laughing here).
- Well, you know, you could probably try incorporating some elements
of some of the more extreme forms, like black metal. I got frustrated with
death metal because a lot of the bands got too goofy, and tried too hard to be
unintelligible with the vocal style. And then black metal came along, and it
took me a long time to really get into it. But to me, the way the forebearers
of the scene discussed the ideologies of black metal and everything: to me it
was really a PROPER evolution; they were trying to do something different, they
weren't trying to regurgitate everything in the past. They said "fuck the
normal way of doing things." Metal has always been a genre that's about
breaking the rules, you know?
Rob: I'm sure you've seen the banger film thing on whatever it was... Not MTV
or whatever. It was all the history of metal, it kinda had a flow chart of all
the subgenres of the genres of the other kind of genres of metal that have
branched off over the years. It's funny really when you think about it; it all
kinda comes from what, Black Sabbath really.
- Yeah, yeah, even Pentagram too from the 70's.
Tim: Greg's band he was in for awhile, Falcon, actually had the singer for them
on one of the tracks. It's all kind of a weird seven degrees of separation
thing with all the metal bands and genres and stuff. I was never really into
like the death metal or the thrash or all that kind of stuff. I'm not saying
there's not good bands that DO that kind of stuff. You listen to our stuff and
that's not really what we were into. I've seen a lot of bands and I'm friends
with a lot of guys that are doing that stuff. Anything metal, for me as long as
it's good, it's done well, it's cool with me, man, I love it.
- I guess with the talk about a new album; you did a long stint with
Metal Blade Records for awhile. Is there any chance you guys might go back to
them? It would be so easy to deal with Metal Blade considering they're kinda
practically in your backyard! (laughing)
Tim: To be honest, the Metal Blade that's really been taking care of us is the
guys in Europe, in Germany. They're the guys that just re-released "Paradise
Lost." Unbelievable packaging. They remastered it separately for the LP's, for
the CD, and like a 12 page color booklet. I don't know if you've seen it. The
albums come in 4 different colors of marble vinyl. They have our whole catalog
right now. That would be the perfect thing for us, but I gotta tell you this;
we have management now and stuff. What we're gonna do is whatever's best for
the band.
We love Metal Blade; Brian (Slagel, founder of Metal Blade - Ed) recently
picked us as one of the top 11 bands, or releases, that he ever put out in
the entire history of his record label. That was a pretty fantastic honor. In
fact we were on there twice because he picked his first album "Metal Massacre
One," which we did 'Death Of The Sun' on. So we were the only band that was on
his list twice. He picked 'King Of The Dead' also. They have our whole catalog
and they're taking care of us and stuff.
My hope would be that we do something with them. What we gotta do is we gotta
look out for whatever's really best for the band. And I think what's best for
the band would be for us to stick together and our longevity, and putting out
some more material. Whatever we do, it's not gonna be weak. Now, are we gonna
evolve, possibly... But you know, evolution is something that happens whether
you want it to or not. You know, like people grow an extra thumb or something
(laughing).
They're gonna hear it and say "That's Cirith Ungol." They're not gonna say
"well, that's the NEW Cirith Ungol," they're gonna say "wow, that sounds like
classic Cirith Ungol.
- Getting back to the essence of who and what you guys are.
Tim: Yes, exactly. We may even play one of our songs backwards note for note.
(MUCH laughter from all of us). I'm just kidding...
Rob: That's off the record. (More laughter here).
- (We started talking a little bit about paganism and vegetarianism.
Some of the stuff I passed on)... It is a shame we can't get into discussions
on things like that. When it comes to politics, I tend to leave that stuff
alone, but I mean...
Rob: I tell you what, if we do make it to ProgPower sometime, we'll hoist a
couple of pints about that and have a good discussion... probably off the
record though...
- I do think we need to take a look at what's going on with this
planet that we live on... 'Doomed Planet' is definitely... You start talking
about the environment and stuff, you get people who go "Oh, damn hippies and
tree huggers..." Dude, you don't go around and trash your house; it's where
you gotta live.
Rob: Hey, Steve, check this out. I was at a party last night; it's like
October, almost November. It was like 85, 90 degrees last night at like 11
o'clock at a party. We live in an area that hasn't rained here in 8 years. Now
it sprinkled last night, just to get the pavement wet. But that was the first
time in probably 12 months. All our lakes are completely empty, there's no
ground water left, there's...
Tim: (interrupting) 'We're gonna bleed, man!' (MUCH laughter here).
- (MUCH laughter here). Sorry man, didn't mean to cut you off.
Rob: I just put a plug in here, I was endorsed by Paiste cymbals. And I got
made one of the most unbelievable drum sets on earth. It's made out of solid
oak and they painted it solid red on the outside. I dunno it's...
Tim: what's that gotta do with 'Doomed Planet?' (MUCH laughter here from all
of us).
- Well, the drummer's gotta talk about his kit, man, come on!
(laughing here again).
Rob: When the band was broke up, I never really wanted to STOP playing drums.
Every single night I'd wake up in the middle of the night, for the last 25
years, having nightmares or dreams about the band. Like we're getting back
together, recording an album, I'm getting a drum set. I'd work on cars and do
stuff like that. And everytime I'd see a cymbal stand or something I'd get
really excited. But when the band got back together, what got me really turned
on was not only playing drums again but being around all the hardware...
Tim: The gong!!
Rob: The gong. Like an 80 inch gong, my wife said she'll leave me if I get it,
the guys in the band said they'll quit the band if I get it, and the other guy
said he won't help me carry it...
Tim: Nobody in the world needs an 80 inch gong (much laughter here).
Rob: Then I said well, a 60 inch gong, and they're like, same thing.
- It's kinda funny you mention that. You talk about a lot of signs
and seeing stuff like that; I tend to believe that if you're in tune, the
universe tends to speak to you a little bit. I see signs and stuff like that
all the time.
People talk about pre manifested destiny and things like that. I really think
that people are on a path and sometimes you can learn to read... It's just like
going out in nature, you can... Okay, I can see this trail where this person...
I don't think we're really in TUNE with our environment, our reality, where
we're at at a certain place and time, you know what I'm saying?
Tim: Yeah, I agree totally. I think what's funny though, I think some people
can, when you look back in time, whether it's Jules Verne or other science
fiction writers... Phillip Dick... or whatever. They kinda semi foresee the
future before the rest of us do.
Rob: My point is though, it's like you don't have to not believe in something
not for it to happen... Not for it... you know (pauses to think about what he
actually said - Ed.) Like people may not believe Cirith Ungol's gonna have a
new album out, but when it hits the shelf... Oh shit! It'll be like a ripple
through the time continuum. (laughter here).
DARK ANGEL.
Interview with the original singer, Don Doty.
It's a goddamn shame... We've read so much in the press about Dark Angel's
reformation, with later era singer Ron Rhineheart in tow, the rest of the
members of Dark Angel going so far as to completely discredit their original
singer who made such a lasting impression on the minds and ears of it's fans,
that it's a shame he hasn't been given much press to tell his side of the
story. In my honest opinion, Dark Angel should do what Rigor Mortis did when
they arrived in Atlanta to play their blistering set of classics: allow both
singers to occupy their songs in their fashion. Even though I was not a huge
fan of Rigor Mortis' songs post Bruce, I did appreciate and even enjoy the
unique chance to hear songs from "Freaks" and "Vs. The Earth" done by none
other than Doyle Bright. So it is this fan's sincerest hope that this is DONE,
to give proper justice to ALL eras of Dark Angel. According to Jim Durkin and
even Gene Hoglan, this will never happen, so at least here you have the next
best thing, the chance to hear the legend SPEAK on these matters, probably for
the first time EVER.
- Obviously, a lot of people are excited about the reunion; it seemed
like it was awhile before anyone started talking about this. It seems like you
guys were talking about it, and Jim Durkin was talking about it, and things
just kind of de-evolved from there.
Yeah. Well, Jim and I were actually talking as well. As a matter of fact, we
were writing a song together, and I still have that song. Jim was all about me
coming back, as a matter of fact he's the one that turned me on to Keep It
True. And the way that came about, was he played the year before with Ruthless.
And he said, "Don, it's a great festival; you'll love it. Go ahead, get D.A.
back together, go ahead and do it. I can't do it right now because of work."
And I said, "Okay Jim, you're going to be missing out, because I'm going to be
booking a couple more shows." He goes, "go ahead and do it, I've just got too
much work right now."
So I get ahold of Eric, Eric's on board, I get ahold of Mike (Sandro?) He's on
board. In fact, he gets one of his buddies from another band to play guitar. I
tried to get ahold of Gene (Hoglan), he didn't respond back to me. So I went
ahead and got ahold of Sascha. And it was like, either way I went I was good to
play; it would either be Gene or Sascha. Well, Gene got wind of that and he was
like "Oh no. I'm Dark Angel. If I'm not going to play, then nobody is going to
play." He basically got all the guys together and said "Look, I've been doing
this 25 years, Doty's been doing it... nothing. Who do you want to go with?
I've got management, I've got everybody. And basically everybody swayed on over
to him. And I said that was cool, no worries. I understood. Actually, Eric
stuck with me. And I told Eric, "Hey dude, don't fuck this up man, get your ass
over there! You're not going to hurt my feelings; do the right thing and go
play these shows!" So he ended up going over there and they played these shows.
I'm the one who booked Chile, I'm the one who booked Sweden Rocks. I booked the
shows that they did, so I know that they were good shows.
That being said, Gene had no intentions of me going because if I went, it would
be like having me and Ron on the stage at the same time. Who's everybody gonna
want to see? "We Have Arrived" and "Darkness Descends." Well, I sang on both of
those. Don't get me wrong, there's a couple of good songs on the other ones,
but everybody is mainly interested in "Darkness Descends."
- That's pretty much the truth of the matter. Don't get me wrong, the
other two albums that came afterwards they weren't bad but they just didn't
have the same feeling to them. They're still decent thrash classics. But "We
Have Arrived" and "Darkness Descends," that's where it was at, you're
absolutely right.
Yeah. That's where it all started; it all started back in high school with
these other two bands called Metallica and Slayer. (wow - Ed.) And nobody was
known. We all practiced at the same damn garage; we all shared each other's
shit. And that's how it was. We all grew up in Downey (California - Ed.) When
we go to take off, everybody starts moving up the ladder, moving up the ladder.
Well, I didn't see any money in it, and I had a great job, married and getting
ready to have my first child. And I needed to make a decision. And that's the
whole thing that everybody doesn't really know about. I actually had been
pulling myself out. That's why, if you look back in time, you'll see that I did
these shows on tour in Corpus Christi in Texas... There were three shows we did
with Megadeth. And I did those, but I just barely made it by like three seconds
on the timeclock Monday when I had to punch in for work. And I said, man, this
is like too freakin' close guys! So they had another tour lined up already, and
I said I couldn't do it. That's when Jim Drabos jumped in. Okay? This is
starting to sound familiar, and it's starting to make sense.
Jim Drabos went ahead and did that tour that I couldn't make, because I was
working. D.A. comes back and they said "Oh shit, we booked another show at The
Country Club, Don, can you do it?" And I said, hell yeah I can do it, It's not
going to interfere with work. And that was August of '87. Of course, Jim Drabos
is out because Don is right here again. So I go ahead and do that show. From
there, I pretty much told the guys look, I can't be doing this no more man, I
can't take off work, I can't do this, you gotta find a replacement for me. Gene
came in and said, "Hey, look, we're gonna do 'The Immigrant Song' from Led
Zeppelin. And I said, Oh, man, I'm definitely out. I'm not doing that song;
that song is too hard to do. Whoever does it, I feel sorry for them. They went
ahead and did it anyways, poor Ron.
- (laughing here).
You can listen to that song and KNOW they shouldn't have done it.
- It just doesn't FEEL like Dark Angel. Ah, you know, it's different!
(laughing here)
It's definitely different. I'm like dude you guys are pulling away from the
core. Jim and I, we had a set direction on where we were going, and Gene had a
different direction on where he wanted to go. Personally, I'm not into the
pedophilia and the mindfucks and shit like that man. I'm into more like war and
stuff. He gets into his shit, you can tell by the last album, the fourth one,
where his mind is. Um, because he wrote it. Matter of fact, he wrote one more
AFTER that one. It's just that they didn't authorize it, they didn't publish
it.
- (Surprised here) You're saying Gene wrote that right, the last few
records for Dark Angel?
Oh yeah... He wrote everything!
- Well here's something interesting, because I noticed when Gene was
with Death, Chuck's lyrics started taking on a different tone. Like 'The
Philosopher' and stuff like that. So it's interesting, like "wow, he lyrically
influenced Death as well." Because Death was doing the zombies and "Scream
Bloody Gore." And even "Leprosy" still had some of that kind of stuff on it...
WOW...
Exactly. He has a big influence, where he goes. He does carry a lot of presence
with him. Don't get me wrong, he's a good drummer as well. He's gotten better
and better over time.
- He's a phenomenal drummer. (laughs).
It's not where I wanted to go, you know. So I simply said, you guys have at it,
I'm bowing out. And I think that really pissed him off. Ron's okay I guess, but
he's... I dunno. He just lacks something; there's something missing. And
everybody can feel it. (I agree wholeheartedly - Ed). Like he just goes through
the motions. But I mean, he's up there doing it, so I give him credit for doing
it, and I give him credit because if he wouldn't have been up there, I wouldn't
have been able to come back and do what I did. I'm not out to down anybody, I'm
not out to put anybody down by any means. I think Gene is still a good drummer.
I've seen a lot of drummers today that are phenomenal. Some of the stuff that
these guys have learned. Even Greg, my drummer now man, he's freakin just
crazy, CRAZY fast and crazy good. I gotta tell him, "hey dude, check this out.
SLOW DOWN... (laughing). I guess they're used to death metal, and death metal
is FAST shit!
- I tell you what blows me away about Gene. I saw him the first time
Strapping Young Lad came to the Atlanta area. Which was many many years ago,
this was before anybody even gave a shit about... Devin Townsend is a pretty
big deal nowadays. Strapping Young Lad had this thing about, they used to use a
drum machine. And I swear, when I first saw them live I had to LOOK back there
to verify that that was an actual drummer playing THAT fucking fast. It just
blew my mind how good he is, and I guess years of experience will do that.
I watch drummers closely, and man some of these guys today are just phenomenal.
Gene's moved up and up and I'm glad for him you know. But when we were talking,
I even told Gene, I said, look, I know that you're still pissed at me for
something. Whatever it is, check it out dude... I'm sorry. Hopefully we can
forget about that and move on. He's like "nope." I'm like "Wait a minute, check
this out. Picture this as a job okay, because that's what it is. You don't go
to work every day, and like the people you work with. But you still go to work
every day. How about if we just come to work, and we do our jobs, and we split.
You ain't gotta hang around me, and I don't have to hang around you. That
cool?" Nope. I said, alright be a dick. Alright fuck you too.
And that's pretty much where we left and we haven't really spoken since. I
suddenly became the estranged singer that was making shit up. Kinda hard to
say that when Mike's been on facebook saying that he's speaking with me. Eric's
been on there talking with me. I've done interviews with Jed. Hard to say I
haven't talked to people because it's obvious that I have. Eric and I wrote a
song together too, that's two songs that we were already going to come out with
for D.A. and they are bad ass songs. And I'm really bummed that the public
doesn't get to hear them. But 'Show No Fear' is a bad ass jam, and Eric wrote
it! Hopefully one day here I'm gonna have Eric come up onstage with me, and
we'll play it! I just gotta wait 'till he's done with D.A. I don't see D.A.
doing a whole lot of stuff right now...
- They're really not, they're kind of inactive but were talking about
festivals. They've done a few shows here and there.
They're not going to be doing too much. Ron is too far away and everybody else
is too far from each other. I think Mike moved too now so they're even farther
from each other. And, how do you make new songs, well, the only way they can do
that is number one, they've already got a new album. The same one that they
didn't get published last time. So they're just gonna redo that one. That's why
he didn't want me on board because I have new material; I have new songs. And
why have Doty come on with new material that's going to be fresh, when they
still have Gene's album that never got published. It doesn't seem feasible, so
you just keep me out of the whole mix and everything will be smooth sailing.
- That kinda blows me away about Jim, because on "We Have Arrived,"
you had Jack Schwartz. Now I don't know what he was like as a drummer, but you
know... (sighs) I guess Gene talked Jim into doing it this way, cause that's
the only thing I can figure...
He did, and you are absolutely right. Jim looks up to Gene, he always has and
he always will. He'll follow Gene wherever he goes. And that's the part that
hurt me, because you see Jim and I... I gave Jim a ride to school when nobody
else would pick his ass up. (I'm laughing here - Ed). I took him out on dates
because he had no car to go in, and I went on double dates with him. You know,
I'm the guy he went to high school with. I'm the guy who started the band with
him; it was Jim, Rob and myself. We started TNT that turned into Shellshock
that turned into Dark Angel. Nobody has been there longer. And it gets me that
he would pick Gene and have Gene tell him "Fuck Doty, we're gonna use Ron
because Doty left us and Ron's always been here.
- Things happen, man, life happens. Surely somebody that's been in
the business for as long as Gene has can understand that, I would think. I
guess not. Do you still talk to Jim Durkin at all, are you still on speaking
terms?
Not after that last stab in the back, when he came out publicly on Blabbermouth
and said "look, if I came back, Ron's always been our foundation, Ron's would
be my singer."
- Yeah, I saw that.
I just went, What? Jim are you serious? Alright dude, that's cool, I see where
you're coming from now. Gene's got him by the nuts. That's cool. It really
pissed them all off when I held the rights to Dark Angel, I held the rights to
the logo because they never, ever applied for them. And that really shot Gene
out because, if I hold the name they can't use it, which means they can't play.
So I went live on Jimmy's radio station down there in L.A. and I said look, I'm
gonna show you guys what a sport I am, I'm gonna pull mine; you guys can have
them. And believe me, Gene had Jim write them up so they could get them. So,
they have the name now. The thing they don't understand is, as long as you can
prove that you had the name BEFORE that, you get the name. And I can prove that
I've had it longer than Durkin. And that's what they don't understand is... I
can still pull the name anytime I like. It doesn't matter that they HAVE it
right now, it's who can prove that they had it FIRST.
- I think it's copyright's law, whoever can prove they trademarked it
first.
Correct. And I can prove it, I have it on documented paper that I had it before
anybody else. See, Jim has one of our first contracts; I have the first, second
and third contracts AND I also have documentation before the contract. He's
unaware of this documentation I had before them... because... You ever heard of
a show called the Gong Show?
- (Whoah! THIS is out of left field!) (laughing here). Yeah,
absolutely.
Remember how long ago that was on?
- Oh, god, like mid to late 70's or something?
79, you bet. Do you know that Dark Angel APPLIED for the Gong Show?
- Are you serious? No I had no idea!
That's right. The manager Don Doty went ahead and wrote up paperwork and
applied. Because I wanted to get gonged, man! I wanted to go on national T.V.
and get my ass gonged for having the fucking bad ass sound up there that the
country had ever heard. That was my plan back then. And I wrote up all the
paper work and wrote me down as the manager and I sent this shit in. Well, we
ended up taking off and going a different way so I never followed it. But I
still have all the paperwork from then with the date. So that shows that I had
it (Dark Angel) back you know, early 80's.
I don't like the drama... I just don't want all the freakin' drama, you know
what I'm saying?
- Yeah, and there seems to be that in the entertainment industry.
I went through that with Hallows Eve; we had a little falling out and what not
too, and I realize that there were a lot of things I did wrong of course. But
being older and more mature... You think when we get to the stage in life that
we're at, that you know, "all right, we're more mature, we've got a lot of
years under our belt, we've got a lot of wisdom, surely we can fix all this
shit." But some people just don't seem to progress. It's kind of a double edged
sword in metal because people gripe at you your when your music progresses, but
when you don't progress as human beings, that's when all the conflict and drama
arises. And the fans really are the ones that get the shaft.
You're absolutely right. And the fans don't wanna hear all your bubblegum stuff
(laughing here - Ed). The fans just wanna hear that you guys are doing more
music and putting out good shit. It's kinda tough whenever you gotta, kinda let
them know where you're coming from. At the same time you don't want to sound
like you're bitching.
- But you don't want to get ripped off either.
Yeah... You see, that's the one I've never even brought up. Do you know how
much money I've seen from "Darkness Descends?"
- Yeah, it's funny, I was about to ask you about that, because Tommy
Stewart, who was in Hallows Eve, he still gets royalties from those 80's metal
albums "Death And Insanity" and "Tales Of Terror." So I was wondering if you
still get royalties... It's a weird situation because Century Media here
apparently stepped in and picked up the rights to all the Combat stuff.
I have not seen one penny from "Darkness Descends." Not one royalty have I been
given. And I'm sure Gene and Jim are fully aware of where all my checks went: in
their pockets. Because that IS me singing on there, and that's my check. I wrote
this shit, I SANG this shit, I should get PAID for this shit. You know, "We Have
Arrived?" I own the rights to because I paid for that whole thing. I got the 2
inch tape, I got the rights. So anybody who wanted to do "We Have Arrived" had to
come to me, which NOBODY has ever done. And I haven't seen a penny from that
either.
- Yeah, I think Dark Descent put that out ("We Have Arrived" - Ed).
Roadrunner actually paid me, I think 3 grand once. But other than that, I
haven't seen a penny additional. There's like a shit ton of money that's owed
to me and I'm aware of that. But I'm not one to make all these complaints and
gripes about it. I'd rather just come out and play some new music. Let them
think they got one over on me, I really don't care. I'd rather keep going. I've
got some bad ass songs that we're writing right now that are gonna put the
industry back on where it needs to be with thrash metal. The changes that are
just gonna knock people on their butt, and it's gonna be bad ass. I'm just
stoked to be out here playing it.
- I can't wait for the Eliminate stuff to come out... I listened to
the video on youtube and I was like "yeah, he knows what the fuck's going on."
Hell yeah, and if you were to have heard 'Pounding From The Grave' or... I
don't know if you've heard 'Syndicate Life'... It's definitely OLD school. It's
good. If I'm gonna put it out I'm gonna like it. I think people are gonna be
humming it in their showers (kaughing here - Ed), they're gonna be humming it
before they go to bed. They're gonna be 'Pounding From The Grave,' duh-duh-duh
da da... (he continues to sing the lyrics). You're gonna have this song, it's
gonna be in your head and you can't get rid of it; I know, because I've been
singing it for 2 freakin' years. I can't get it out of my head!
Right now we're trying to line everything up so we can get in the studio,
because we have to do these now because they want to do a record.
- Who's that going to be released through, do you know?
I'm actually looking at three different labels, so I'm bascially going to put
it out there as a bidding war. Whoever wants it can have it. Just tell me what
you're gonna give me; some tour support, a little bit of money to throw at the
studio and it's yours. And I know they'll make money, because metal is
DEFINITELY around. It's maybe not as back in full force but the hard cores are
always gonna be there, ya know? The fans that are there, I know I can count on
them, and I know thet they're true, it's so cool.
- As you mentioned that, I had a talk with Jeff Shirilla from
Abdullah, and we talked about... there was a period in the early to mid 90's
where grunge was taking over, and white kids were starting to listen to rap
music. We kinda lamented about that, but the thing is, some kids don't want to
be listening to what their parents are listening to. Their parents are
listening to metal, so they get into something else.
True
- I've been doing the music magazine for 25 years; I started
Vibrations Of Doom in 1992, and I didn't even KNOW that metal was dead; I had
no idea. Because you know, I was into it and everything; I decided to make it
my life's work. But now metal HAS come back because the I guess the parents
that were listening to grunge and rap; THEIR kids now are like "I ain't
listening to that shit" and they're back on metal. But metal has been around
since the late 60's/early 70's, and it's never really died.
Metal's in your blood; either it's there or it's not. And if you gotta have
that driving beat; if you hear that, it makes you wanna get up and just makes
you want to move. It's something inside of us; I know, whenever I hear it, it
sparks up my whole life. And that's why I'm so stoked about playing again. And
with the guys I have I've never been so lucky in my life. To have Henry and
Kelly, it's just phenomenal. Now I have Doug doing bass; he reminds me of Rob
he's just like, back in the day. Everything's just falling into place! Greg's
got the drums...
I'm so stoked to see metal coming back, and I know that the festivals are all
happening over there. I feel stoked that we got to headline the Armageddon
Festival 4, it was really cool. I noticed that Dark Angel hasn't done any
headlining which kinda makes me laugh.
- Well, they've done some in South America, but nothing here in the
States yet.
I've headlined my own tour here, already. That's all I've done is headlined.
It's going to continue that way when we go over to Europe; I KNOW we're gonna
be huge in Europe. I can FEEL it. People are stoked about the band; the guys I
have they have their own followings. And it's so cool because everybody backs
them so much. I dunno, I'm just blessed I guess.
- Now I wanna take you back a bit; I wanna go back to 1983. You guys
put out a couple of demos before the first full length came out like "Gonna
Burn" and "Hell's On It's Knees." I'm looking at songs like 'Eternal
Captivity,' 'Metalhead,' um.... What was the other track on "Gonna Burn" that I
liked?
'Hammer Away...' (He sounds like he's a little disappointed by this question -
Ed.)
- Yeah, 'Road Warrior.' And I'm sitting here thinking... I've seen
favorable reviews of those early songs, how come they never made it to the
first full length... Or beyond?
No, no, no, no... they weren't... They were thrown together, that we put
together... I think his name was Mark. We got together in his garage one day
and we just started putting these songs together. We did like 'Road Warrior,'
you know, 'Demons on the highway in search of rape and lust, when he guns
the throttle, leaves others in the dust.' The words aren't all that, you know
what I'm saying? They were good at the time, they were something we were
putting together, we were kinda getting the feel of things. We definitely
progressed quickly, and we knew what we wanted; we just didn't know how to get
it yet. But by the time we put it together, that's when "We Have Arrived"
started. 'Gonna Burn' is just totally commercial (laughing here - Ed). It
wasn't really what we were striving for. Like 'Hell's On It's Knees' actually
made it to the record, but it was one of the few that did. And after that, we
definitely, you'll see a jump in progression. You know, we went to "We Have
Arrived," and then we went to "Darkness Descends." And I thought we were
definitely moving in the right direction. But then we took a left turn into the
psychological, and I kinda... kept going straight.
- Well, sometimes that can kinda be a little scary in and of itself.
Anything to deal with the mind and disabilities of the mind. I'm kinda on a
psychological bent sometimes you know; philosophical mostly. And I get why
maybe that change was made; you had a lot of the metal bands, especially in the
early days... You had Venom with black metal, then you had Possessed doing the
first death metal song, supposedly. So I guess maybe bands felt the lyrical
content of their albums was kinda stifling. How often can you sing about demons
and gore, zombies and satanism and stuff.
I understand that maybe they were trying to up the game a little bit. Because
metal has had a bad rap since the beginning. And Metalheads are sometimes given
the impression that they're stupid, that they don't have any intelligence, they
just walk around being brutal. But I've seen some bands write some well thought
out and very verbose lyrics; just take Carcass and what not.
Oh yeah, there's a lot out there. And when Gene was helping writing, I loved
the breath of fresh air of something different. It did make you think, and that
was cool. I had to learn them as well. Gene is very gifted in the way of having
a photographic memory. He was learning one word a day, and just the one word a
day, and he could retain them. And that's really helped him in his writing. And
that was a good thing. I think it got a little bit out of control on the third
and fourth album. Too many words can hurt a song. You know, you gotta be
somewhat repetitious, you gotta be somewhat catchy. You gotta have a hook, and
if you don't, you're just making noise. It's music for a reason; because you can
listen to it, you can enjoy it... And I believe that can be done with ANY kind
of music; I listen to a lot of punk rock...
- I did too...
I don't care if you're SCREAMING the lyrics, you're still gonna have a hook in
it. And D.R.I., and Dead Kennedys, and everybody else who we listen to...
- Fear... (laughing here)...
Fear yeah. The guys are up there giving their all, but they still have hooks in
their songs, and you were humming that shit when you walked away.
- It's funny you mention "a lot of words," because some of those
earliest songs, especially on "Darkness Descends," I'm like... "How the fuck
does he do this," because there's a LOT of lyrics in some of those songs.
Especially a song like 'Black Prophecies.' But 'The Burning Of Sodom,' it's
almost like rapid fire lyrics, and that's gotta be tricky to do onstage. I
think I saw the 'Perish In Flames,' you know where the line stops and the next
one just kinda picks right up. That's gotta be difficult to do live, especially
if you're moving around and what not. I'm not one that can just stand behind a
microphone, I'm all over the place! (laughing here)
I tell ya, 'The Burning Of Sodom' was supposed to be the fastest song that you
could actually sing something to. And that's what I was striving for. And I
thought I pretty much hit it, because anything beyond that, I was tongue tied!
We sped it up and we slowed it down until it got to right there. You can
actually hear every word I'm saying if you listen and read along. It was
difficult, I did have to do it many, many times, and I did do it many times in
practice alone. It was a feat to get it all in and make it somewhat
understandable. Because that's the bottom line, is you gotta understand what
the person is saying. You have to be able to articulate what you're trying to
put across.
It was fun, though, I really did enjoy it. I enjoyed trying to do different
things and different styles. When you hear 'Black Prophecies' you're gonna hear
that there's so many different phrasings in the singing.
- That's the longest song on the album too...
I give Gene credit for that, because he actually did that. It's a great song;
it's longer than life, but it was a great filler. And he did a really good job
with that, and I was pleased to sing it. I did change a couple of little things
in it, and I just made it my own. And that's what you gotta do with any song
that you have; you make it your own so it fits you...
- Who wrote the lyrics for "Darkness Descends?"
That's basically a split, myself and Gene.
- So which songs did you write?
Let's see here. 'Burning Of Sodom' has mine, it has Gene and I think Jim on it
too. 'Darkness Descends' itself was Gene. You'll find 'Merciless Death' was
mine. You have 'Hunger Of The Undead' and 'Death Is Certain' was Gene, and
'Perish In Flames' was me. It's kinda split down the middle; I personally felt
that Dark Angel wrote "Darkness Descends," because we all have our inputs, and
we all contribute, so I think the whole band wrote it personally.
- So what kinda stuff were you into as far as lyrical influences?
I mean, some of the songs it's kinda... obvious... But uh... Still love that
cover, to this day!
I personally like anything having to do with the Third World War... Anything
having to do with history, anything having to do with war itself, future
events, things that are going on right now in our country. Things that were
really gonna happen, that were actually happening. I was writing this song
not too long ago about the Red Baron; who he was, what he did, why he was
named this and that. It was a pretty good song. It has to fit, you know,
everything has to click. We dropped a lot of songs, because after we did
them, we just... there was something not there for us. That's why D.A. never
had a lot of songs. Probably one of the few bands that you'll hear a song on
the first album that's again on the second album (laughs). I mean, how many
bands do that? I don't know of any... Just Dark Angel!
- You know, usually when I see that, I always thought that was kinda
weird... But usually when I see that happen it's because.. Like just for an
example: "okay, ''We Have Arrived'' had this singer, and it repeats on a
different album because we had a different singer." Most bands, that's why you
hear the same song repeated on an album, because somewhere in the middle, they
transitioned and there's a new singer in the band. Like the song 'Merciless
Death...' I can see the difference on the "We Have Arrived" version as opposed
to the "Darkness Descends" version. And mainly for me, it's kinda like
production... You know?
A lot of it is production. And we changed up the beginning a little bit, where
the bass is a little different, and different drums. For the most part, you
know, we needed another song because we didn't have that many. So we pulled one
of the ones that everybody liked, and we kinda redid it and thought "hey, Gene,
check this out, you get to do this now, so what would you do?" And it was nice
to have a little comparison, and the crowd already knew the song, so when we
played it they just sang right along with us, which is always cool.
- Now a lot of people talk about the production of "Darkness
Descends," and whenever anybody talks about "D.D." and they talk about things
like this, I jump right in. A lot of people talk about how murky and muddy the
production was, but that's what gave it that PERFECT fucking atmosphere. Some
bands, like I'll give you an example, I don't know if you're familiar with the
death metal band Krisiun?
Yeah, I've heard of them...
- They are so brutal live, but on record they just sound so lifeless
because their recording production is so crisp and clean, it just sucks all the
brutality out of the album...
Correct. And that's what we were going for. We had done the studio already so
we knew what we DIDN'T want. And when we came in, we knew that we weren't going
to play slower, we weren't going to play faster; we're gonna play at the same
speed, the same tones... we were going to capture what you get live. We all
thought, you know, it was a little bit muddy, but that's how we sound, and that
is what we agreed on and what we went with. And Sean did a great job with
mastering; he brought it all together and cleaned it up enough that it was
listenable. The mix was just dead on. Everything came together and the spots
that were empty, he hit that button and that reverb would kick in. And it was
filling in just perfect. It was really an excellent job on mixing. We were very
lucky there.
We've always liked that heavy, muddy... It gives it life, you know? We're not
perfect, and if you come to see us live, don't expect a perfect performance,
but you can expect to be involved with it. And if I gotta jump off that stage
and land on your ass, that's what I'm gonna do (laughing here - Ed). Know that!
I get into the crowd a lot, and I really do enjoy it...
- For a few years, it took me awhile to get into black metal. Mainly
because of all the stuff that happened with the murders and the church burnings
and all that stuff. Over time, the genre won me over. I kinda got sick of death
metal because whenever people would make fun of metal that's kinda what they
would do, that "rrrrr, rrrr, rrr" shit.
The cookie monster thing...
- Yeah, well a lot of death metal bands just got ridiculous. I was
just curious if you were into black metal, how you saw that. Because it's
gotten to be a pretty popular form of metal; we're having more and more of the
Scandinavian bands come over here than we ever did before.
Yeah, that's true. I listened to the death and I listened to the black.? Are
they my favorites? No, because my heart is in thrash, I still like punk, which
is way over on this side. But that's where I came from and that's where I'm
comfortable. I'm comfortable not so much talking about Satan and God and the
wars that are between them, it's more like... you know, check this out. We all
have it tough, we all have a shit ton sometimes and we can all relate to that.
But, here's the thing: when you come to a show, you get to forget about all
that stuff! You get to just be free, and not have to worry about nothing. And
that to me is freeing.
Yeah, I listen to the other stuff, I listen to everything. I listen to Taylor
Swift (much laughter here), because my daughter listens to Taylor, so I gotta
listen to Taylor Swift! I even listened to Miley Cyrus for awhile, so there!
That's no joke. Whatever my kids are listening to, that's who I'm listening to
with them, right? I got to hear some of the rap and the T.V. pop and other
stuff. And my other son, he's into hardcore shit. He's into it, and that's
cool. He's right down Dad's lane. I do appreciate all that's been done, and
I'm glad that everybody got to express themselves in different ways. I don't
dislike anybody or anything that they're doing. I do think it's for certain
crowds though, and if you don't belong, you shouldn't go; if you don't like
one song, you're not gonna like the rest.
I like to be a bit more diversified. I don't like to be pinned down and said
"Okay, well this is all you're allowed to sing about Don!" (laughing here -
Ed). Because that ain't gonna happen. And I'm gonna break a lot of molds, and
people are gonna see that you know what? I'm gonna do things different. And
it's gonna be good stuff, because I've got the backing to make it good.
- As far as lyrics go too, there's so many things out there. Just off
the top of my head, I was shooting lyric ideas with a friend of mine from
Bulgaria. There's the Ica Stones, there was a nuclear bomb dropped off the
coast of Tybee Island; obviously with the ISIS and Syria thing, there's still
Egyptian mythology, Nordic mythology that hasn't been fully touched upon.
There's about 10,000 years of history if all you want to write about is
history. That'll keep you busy for 5 or 6 albums! (laughing here).
That was my point. You already tapped on one of the things I have a song about.
It's of the gods. People don't know our gods; you know, who is Poseidon, who is
Zeus. I wrote a song about that, people need to know that shit, and it's good
shit! They're gonna learn something, but they're gonna be singing metal while
they do it! And that's the cool part!
I can't wait to put it out there for 'em. It's gonna change the way people look
at, at least, our little square of the world.
- Yeah, dream big or go home!
And that's me man, I am a big dreamer. I see us doing some pretty big things. I
have a couple of outreaches that I really wanna do. I have outreaches for even
schools. For the kids. I wanna do a drum cadence, and I want my drummer to do
this cadence. I want the kids to go ahead and do their cadences and come and
match, and whoever does it the best is more than welcome to come and open up
one of our shows for us. I think that would be an awesome opportunity for those
kids to get recognized at the same time. It brings all the fans to the show,
because they're gonna be bringing all their friends. It's a good way to promote
music. And we're keeping it positive so the kids aren't out doing dope and gang
shootings and everything else. They're focusing on music. If everybody gets on
board with it, I think it will work well. If not then I'll just shut up and
kick back. (laughs).
- When we go back to "We Have Arrived..." And the Azra Record label
is VERY interesting to me from a collector's perspective. Not the least of
because I've seen "We Have Arrived" on a punk/zombie/skull picture disc. But
what was Azra Records like to be on; were they easy to communicate with, did
they give you a good deal...
Oh my gosh. Dave Richards. Dave Richards was a very unique man. And by the way,
I'm still looking for him, because I want to tell him hey and thanks. I can't
find him; I've put it out there. He was definitely ahead of his time. He saw
things and he saw what people were going to be wanting to collect later in
life. And he was making it right then for them. He would take his bands like
Jag Panzer, and Dark Angel, and he would take their songs... I have a 45 record
and it's pictured like a christmas tree, and it has 'Merciless Death' on it!
- Man, that's HILARIOUS!
Tell me that's not the coolest thing you've ever heard! There's another one
that's a picture of a heart! And this little heart spins around on a 45. And
it's playing 'We Have Arrived.' It's some crazy ass shit. But there's people
out there collecting it today, and if you could find one, they're worth a
little bit of money.
He saw things, and he would do picture discs for EVERYBODY. He actually DID pay
us! We didn't make a whole lot of money from him, but you know. I made the
statement earlier, I've never seen anything from "Darkness Descends," which I
didn't. "We Have Arrived," I saw a check from Roadrunner for almost $2200 and
one for $800 from Azra. So I've seen about 3 grand. Again, to have somebody
give you a paycheck, tells you "hey, at least he's trying to be honest, and
he's giving us our money."
I don't have anything bad to say about Dave. He definitely made things happen.
I know we needed money one time... Here's a little tidbit for ya. Dark Angel
needed to fund some things, right. And Dave goes "hey, I know a way you guys
can make FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS, RIGHT now." And we all said "How, what do we
do, what do we do?"
He goes, "well, you can't laugh now." And I said "Oh no, we won't laugh, sure."
"What I want you to do is I want you to all get kazoos, and I want you to play
'Deep In The Heart Of Texas' for me." (laughing here). That's what we did; we
all laughed our asses off. And when we were done getting up off the floor, he
goes "Okay, will you guys do it?" And we went "What, you're serious?" He goes,
"Yeah, I got a guy who will buy THIS record, as long as it has 'Deep In The
Heart Of Texas.' Doesn't care what instrument you play, so use kazoos. And we
will give you guys a different name." We ended up calling ourselves Billy Joe
Bob And The Bo Hicks. We did 'Deep In The Heart Of Texas' on kazoo, and I HAVE
it. I have one of the very few copies, ever. He got us our 5 grand, it paid our
bill... Everything was cool; it worked! We did what we had to do and we had a
good time doing it, because man, you listen to that you can't HELP but laugh!
- You may have to release that someday! (MUCH laughter here)
Oh, someday I will, I DEFINITELY will. We are cracking up SO hard you can't
help but join in laughing. Just one of those things.
- Finally, I just wanted to ask what were some of your favorite
shows? Did you ever play with like Whiplash, Destructor, Shok Paris and 80's
bands like that? I'm just curious what some of your most memorable shows for
Dark Angel were
Everybody kinda remembers the Fender show, in Long Beach, they had some rafters
above the crowd. And what they did is they greased the rafters so nobody could
climb up on them. Well, above the stage there were rafters as well, but nobody
greased those. So I get out there and I climb up on the rafters and I get out
above the crowd and I find out there's grease on 'em! So I do like anybody else
and I woop! And here I go into the crowd. Bam, and they catch me and start
crowd surfing me. Well, sure enough, I get to hear my verses coming up and I
push everybody aside right? Don't ever push ANYBODY aside if you're crowd
surfing. If you push everybody aside there's nobody below you.
Down I went right, and I hit my head on the concrete. And I'm walking up to the
stage and I hear this guy going "Doty! Check your head!" And I'm like "what the
hell" right? So I see some blood. So I'm walking up to the stage and I grab a
terry cloth towel and some duct tape and I put the terry cloth towel on my eye
and the duct tape around my head. And I start introducing, what I think, is the
next song. And needless to say, I had a spiel for each song back then. And I go
through this whole spiel and I see the crowd just staring at me. And I go "what
the fuck is everybody's problem!??" They're like 'Doty, you just introduced the
song you just did!' And I'm like 'Oh, shit.' There's blood coming down my face
and they're like, 'Doty, get your ass to the fuckin' hospital!' I'm all woozy
now and I'm thinking, "yeah, I better." Well, I go down and I get 22 stitches
in my head. And I'm thinking "well, how did the show go?" (laughs).
It's times like that when you look back and you go "man, we had a lot of good
times." We played a lot of good shows. It was us and Slayer at the Hollywood
Palladium. It was SO packed. Venom was supposed to be the headliner but they
backed out. So it was just Slayer and Dark Angel.
- We heard that story here in Atlanta too. Years ago they were
supposed to play a show in Atlanta. There's even a T-shirt printed up from I
think it was '86 or '88. Whoever was opening for them it was just those bands
and Venom never showed. I dunno what their deal was.
And that's what they did. But they didn't realize that Slayer and Dark Angel
were a good enough bill to pack the place. The place was so packed that the
fire department showed up and were kicking people out because people were
jumping off the balconies into the crowd. It was so bad ass! It was like three
pits going on. It was fucking phenomenal; it was one of the best shows I ever
played! I'll hold that memory for the best of my life.
We toured with Megadeth; Dave is one of the coolest people you'll ever meet in
your life. We kinda grew up together, we all practiced at Ron McGovney's house
and we all hung out there. We played Radio City, we played Woodstock and
Anaheim. They'd come out to our shows and they'd say "hey, great, I never heard
'Am I Evil' like that before," we played it at Mach 10! (laughter on both
sides). We had good times, we backed each other up and we went to each other's
shows.
- Did Dark Angel ever make it to Europe during the 80's or was that
much later?
What happened was, in '87 when I took off, they were offered a European tour.
And I didn't hear about it and I had backed myself out all the way. And I guess
they knew about it and they were holding on to it; I guess Gene knew about it
and was holding on to it, until I had backed myself all the way out and then
they announced it and they announced Ron (Rineheart - Ed). If I would have knew
about it, we might have had a different Dark Angel today. (Gasp - another one
of those split second decisions that changed the course of music history - Ed).
But I didn't hear about it so I think I did the right thing. I stuck by my
family, I waited until they were all grown and you know, it's time to come on
back and finish what we started.
They did get one tour, I think it was like in... probably in '87 or '88.
Because I had just done the last show at the Country Club and then they went
ahead and announced it.
DROIDS ATTACK.
Interview with Brad via phone.
The power of the riff! These guys got it in spades... People ask me ALL
the time why I still do what I do for almost no money, 26 years on and very few
accolades? Folks, BANDS LIKE THIS, who I discover on a regular basis. That
nobody seems to know who the hell they are, even with their 15 or so years in
existence! Like the review said, the power of the riff, something Megadeth
tapped into way back on "Peace Sells," but hasn't truly capitalized on since.
Well, meet the band who crafts more riffs on ONE ENTIRE ALBUM than most bands
can muster in an entire career! Read on. This interviews gets REALLY deep,
especially philosophical, proving once again that I am dedicated to bringing
out the innermost thoughts of my interview subjects.
- Well, obviously you got the review, and I'm sitting here going,
"damn, where the fuck has this band been all my life?"
(laughs). Well, that's cool; we're around. We've been around for about 15, 16
years now? Well, Tony and I, my drummer, we've been jamming since 1998, but
Droids started late 2001 kinda. Originally we were trying to find a bass player
to jam with and it took us a few years until we found someone solid enough:
Once that happened we put out our first record in 2004. And then we've just
been "riding it out" ever since.
- It's just wierd that you guys have so many full lengths out and
this is the first time I'm hearing about you guys. And I'm like "where's the
press, where's the publicity, why aren't these guys being talked about more
than they are?"
I think that's just because we've been pretty independent with every release
that we've ever done. We used to work with a label that was a local label; they
put out the first three records of ours, and we put out a split 12 inch with
another label out of Minnesota. But none of these labels had a lot of
promotional budgeting. So we actually promote ourselves. This last record, we
probably put up about $1,500 dollars to promote it. And when you put a little
effort into that, word spreads easier. It's a lot easier to throw money at
press than it is booking an entire tour and taking the time off to do that.
It's the approach I guess. This is the most heavily promoted album we've done.
All the other albums that we've done, we've thrown a little money at promoting
it and we'd mainly hit the road and go on tour. But I think that's kinda like
putting the cart before the horse, you know, you're rolling into towns where
people don't know who you are. And yeah, you make friends and connections and
that's great but that's kind of a small scale effort. Whereas if you put more
money or more effort into promoting yourselves before you go on tour, that
makes more sense. I guess we're slow on learning that.
- I Guess once again it all goes back to promotion. But if you get on
a tour with a bigger band, and people are going, "Hey, I like this band but
check out this band that opened up for them, they're pretty kick ass. Down here
in Atlanta we have this pay to play thing, or paying to get on shows, which I
think is totally wrong. People are forgoing the way the business used to be
back in the day; it's not QUITE like that anymore. And more independent labels
are realizing that bands don't wanna sign with labels and get stuck with a 7
album contract, then the bands break up after two or three albums; then here
comes the lawyers (laughing here).
Sure, sure. I think the business has changed a lot; the whole industry has
changed a lot. I think it's changed more in the artists' favor, because you can
reach a broader audience on your own; with the internet, you can plug into a
lot of these different websites like bandcamp. That's the one we're on. I know
there's like soundcloud... Back when we first started there was myspace and
facebook. There's all these different places where you can have a presence and
there's people hanging out and checking stuff out if they want to. Back when we
were doing those tours; when we were organizing these small scale tours like
I'm saying... That was kinda WHY we did it that way, because we were able to.
We could book shows by sending out electronic press kits, or checking out other
bands on facebook in a town that we were rolling through, and be like "hey, you
wanna play a show with us?"
I think it's changed a lot in that sense that bands are more able to get out
there and do what they want to do and have more exposure than they would in,
say, the 80's or early 90's even... Before the internet I guess. But, there's
not a lot of money for one particular project that gets spread out through
everybody's project now. It's just a different industry, and I think our genre
of music is a smaller slice of the pie... the whole market. But we're not doing
this for money, we're doing it because we love metal music; we love playing and
doing what we do. So I don't give a shit if we don't ever get rich off it; we
just wanna play and have a good time.
- You know, I hear that a lot from indie... Well, I say "indie," but
I mean bands that aren't on huge labels. You know, I don't care who you are;
you love what you do... you should be compensated for it; that's your time
that you spend recording songs, your time away on the road. I hear that all the
time but I'm like "there IS a way to have both." A lot of people have a poverty
mindset instead of an abundance and prosperity mindset, and they think "well,
because nobody else around me is making a living, I can't either," and that's
such a limiting belief, regardless.
Naw, man, there is money to be made, I'm not saying there's not. We have a jam
space next to Bongzilla, and those dudes have been on tour geez, this whole
entire year I think. And they're doing alright for themselves, you know. They
have been around for quite awhile. So, I just kinda feel like if we just keep
at it eventually, you know, the snowball effect will come into play at some
point. It already is kinda, heading that direction a little bit. Every release
we do we seem to pick up some more attention and getting more opportunities.
We're not really booking ourselves as heavily as we used to right now, because
we get opportunities coming to us. So we kinda pick and choose what we want to
do. It's cool; we're not at that level yet where we can just roll into any town
and people are gonna be waiting there for us (laughs). It's just a slow burn
(laughs.)
- Now I wanna talk about Crustacean Records, because obviously that's
been your label of choice for just about all of your existence. I guess you
said they were based out of your area? I don't really know much else about 'em!
(laughing here).
Yeah, back when we first started... Kind of an interesting history. Our bass
player, Darwin, he used to be booking a club here in town. He booked us our
first show ever, in Madison. And at the time, he was at the helm of Crustacean
Records. He liked us, he put us on the label, and we put the first record out.
After awhile, some other guys bought into Crustacean and took over. Then the
direction of the label kinda changed. The person who took over started favoring
more nationally known acts. But we were doing well enough because we were
getting out on the road and he thought we were representing the label well
enough that he thought "yeah, let's keep working with Droids." So we stayed on
the label for awhile. And they were really flexible with us.
It was cool working with them; they set up showcases, distribution networks for
the records, and they helped us out, I'd say a great deal, in establishing
ourselves in the midwest region where we're from. But then the guy who took
over the label decided his time was up and he left. And once he left, nobody
else was really doing anything with it so we decided to put the record out
ourselves for this new release.
So, we've never done this before (laughing here) in charge of everything. But
it's pretty cool; we set up a website - it's not that sophisticated. But we get
steady orders online for our stuff, and every weekend I'm heading to the post
office with a pile of merch to send off. It's something I never really had to
do myself before, but it's kinda fun.
- The new record blew me away, it's obvious you guys know "the power
of the riff" (laughing here). As I like to say. In the review, I thought it was
important, because I grew up in the 80's around 80's metal. So I grew up with
Megadeth and Slayer, and I even got into the extreme stuff like Venom and Iron
Angel. I just remembered that Megadeth's "Peace Sells" had so many great riffs
in just like the first two or three songs. And it would take most bands like
YEARS to come up with enough riffs to do that. And you guys have fucking riffs
ALL over the damn place! (he's laughing here). Wow, you know. Granted, some of
them, after awhile you hear a familiarity towards the end of the record... Not
that that's a drawback or anything, but you just get familiar with the riffing
style that you guys have. I see bands that can't even come up with HALF that
many riffs on an album!
Yeah, sure. You know, our process of writing... it's definitely guitar
centered, but it's also very rhythmic. I'm the guitar player, but I'm also more
of a drummer than a guitar player. I used to play drums in bands for many years
until all the bands broke up and I was left with nothing to show for all the
work that I put into these bands. I decided I'm going to have to learn how to
play guitar and come up with my own songs. So that's what I decided to do and
this is the style I kinda came up with. It's based on a lot of the music that I
like listening to, like Clutch, Helmet and Tad. Black Sabbath and stuff like
that. And yeah, there's a lot of guitar oriented bands.
But being a drummer, I think I'm more like I guess attracted to really heavy
rhythyms and stuff like that. And also with the style of music, I kinda wanted
to come up with a SOUND that people could recognize, like "hey, that sounds
like Droids Attack," you know? And I think that's what you're noticing with
that repetitiveness. We kinda just sort of "hang around" in the same territory,
but we try to take it different places. I don't want to be boring with what
we're doing. Hopefully we achieved that.
- Oh yeah, well, those differences shine right through. I think what
blew me away... I'm like "Am I REALLY hearing a fucking saxophone back there
just going at it?!??" (laughing here). That blew me away!
Ha ha! Yeah, yeah. I just kinda heard it there, I said "you know what would be
kinda cool?" And I think it worked out, I kinda like the saxophone. I listen to
all sorts of different music too, it's not just all heavy stuff. I think I draw
some inspiration from bands that have more instrumentation. One of my favorite
bands growing up was Morphine. I dunno if you ever listened to them at all.
There's a bass guitar and a saxophone and a drummer. Mostly. They had some
other instrumentation in there too but that was their core. And they rocked, I
loved Morphine, so that's where that came from. It's really good stuff.
- Going back to that album. I think it's the track 'Mashenomak...'
Kind of a doom metal thing going on here for most of that. The 8 minutes and
27 seconds length.
It's a long one. That one it tells a story and I think that's why it ended up
being as long as it did. It's actually TWO stories that are related, that's
why you have 'Mashenomak' and 'Mashenomak Strikes Again.' It's based on a
Native American folk tale about the fish monster. And then the second story is
actually about our ex-bass player who had a run in (laughing) with a boat
accident where their boats flipped over and uh, they learned about the Native
American folk tale AFTER the fact. So we kinda made up a story, that was kinda
funny, to go along with it.
Since I was telling a story, I had to have so many verses and so many points in
order to tell the story. The music would kinda follow the story you know, I
dunno, you add dramatic parts and build suspense. Being a Native American folk
tale, I wanted to have Native American rhythms and drums in there. It was a
very different kind of approach to our songwriting.
- Yeah, the percussion was kinda unusual.
Usually what we do when we write music; we start with a riff and then we see
where it goes. And then lyrics kinda come later; we'll be practicing, joking
around and the lyrics just kind of "come up" (laughs) as we're jamming. But
this one, it's like the lyrics came first. It was a different kind of exercise
in the songwriting, but it fits in, with what we're doing.
- When I first heard the lyrics, I'm thinking... And I'm a HUGE fan
of this guy. Fish monster, Bam! first thing that clicked was Lovecraft!
(laughing here).
(slight pause) Ha ha ha! I dunno man, Lovecraft, maybe he was influenced by
the Native American folk tales!
- A lot of people wonder where he got his influence. I'm of the
opinion; maybe this guy could astral travel or astral project. Not that this
stuff with the Necronomicon and Chthulu, Azagthoth, and Dagon are all real,
but you kinda wonder because a lot of people complain about Lovecraft's writing
being so dry and kinda... He's just matter of factly telling this as if he's
seen this like thousands of times in his dreams or his visions. Me personally,
I don't dream the same things every night, but you wonder...
(laughs). Yeah, I mean our whole album "Sci Fi Or Die" is based on ancient
alien theory. I dunno if you know much about it; there's a whole series they've
done based on it. Erich Von Daniken wrote a book years and years ago; I think
it was back in the 60's. He was a bible scholar and he started kind of... He
would read the texts and basically he would replace the word "God" with
extraterrestrials. And then all of a sudden it's like it kinda makes sense.
Adam and Eve were genetically engineered humans, and they created us to be a
slave race. And they put us on this planet to do hard labor, and then they
abandoned us and now we're left here. It's just a very interesting concept.
It's so funny though, because you can say all these things in theory but people
just say "dude, you're nuts. That's fucking stupid."
- Oh Yeah, really. (laughing here).
But is it any more dumb than any other religious belief? (laughs). So we
decided to go with it and we came up with a lot of the songs based on the
ancient alien theories. There's a wealth of material there: I really enjoyed
writing music about that stuff. There might be some more ancient alien themes
to come.
- I see the song 'The Annunaki' too. As far as like recorded, written
history... And I'm a huge history buff as well. My parents got into some wacky
religious ideologies and I was frustrated because, you know, my holidays were
being taken away and this and that and the other. I had a friend at school tell
me "you wanna get to the bottom of all this religious shit, you need to start
REALLY paying attention to history." Obviously, our first written civilization,
as far as anything we have record wise, goes back to the ancient Sumerians.
Well, you know, you have... The Annunaki!
I know I upset a lot of people when I say this... I'm a very ardent, almost
fanatical hater of christianity. Just because you read the bible, and you see
what's going on in the world and you realize that if there is a loving creator
that demands our respect, love and worship... He's basically abandoned us.
If you look at it that way. They've been waiting for the messiah for over 2000
years (laughing here). You just gotta wonder. I try and take a middle road, as
I get older, and realize that... Maybe there's a middle ground: Maybe there's a
creative force but it's probably NOT the way it's detailed in the bible.
You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, yeah I do. And that's ultimately what I teach my children. I say "there
are forces that are trying to separate us as a race on this planet for their
own purposes." And obviously we came from SOMEWHERE. Nobody knows where that
is, or maybe somebody does and they're not saying, but WE don't know. There is
just one unquestionable truth, and that IS that there is a creative force in
the galaxy here. Whether it's within ourselves and we're all dreaming this and
projecting this on our own, or whether it was something that created us all and
we're in this together. Yeah. It's undeniable that there's a creative force in
the world. You choose how you want to believe in that force, but... just don't
treat people like shit! (laughing here - Ed). And do the best you can. And you
will be fine, you know? That's my whole religious (laughing here on both
sides) theory I guess.
- I try to teach my kid that. My parents, they wanted to teach MY kid
about their truth. And at the time I didn't see anything wrong with it. But
coming from a controlling and almost stifling religion like the jehovah's
witnesses... And you're probably sitting there going "wow, really?" It's funny
because as a rational adult, as a thinking adult... As someone who advocates
Aleister Crowley when he actually said that "the learned man is a renaissance
man" who studies and looks at all different cultures and religions, ideologies
and philosophies. I realize that there are some fundamental truths to what even
THEY teach; as crazy as jehovah's witnesses are looked at in this day and age.
But, there's still other things that make me go "okay, well first of all,
basically, the core tenets of your beliefs go back to the ancient old testament
and women are still basically enslaved under your doctrines and ideologies." So
basically, you're not WITH the 21st century. And there's other things; I won't
elaborate on them. But there's things I admire about them and then there's
things I absolutely detest.
Right. Well, people I think are way smarter. People dog out the younger
generations all the time. Like, "oh, these kids, they're so self absorbed; they
got their cellphones in their face," blah blah blah and whatever. But the fact
is, people are smarter now than they've ever been. Because we have more access
to information and we're just passing it around. I'm learning new things every
day! And because of that I think religion is kind of... it's obsolete. A lot of
organized religion is becoming obsolete. And I think that's a good thing. Like
our government, like the music industry is going to have to ADAPT to a more
learned society. You know? Just like the music industry is going to have to
adapt to bands that don't really need them as much as they used to. Anybody who
wishes it was the same way it was before I think... whatever, just don't do it
anymore, get out of the way and let progress happen. I like that direction that
we're heading in as a species.
- I do too. Humanity's always had it's share of problems... I think a
glaring example to me; I had a girl I was involved with who couldn't even do
basic math! And I'm like... you go into a store, and you purchase something
that's maybe 19 dollars and 86 cents. If you're not educated and informed, how
do you know the sales clerk isn't taking advantage of you? Same with religion,
I get people at work all the time that go "Oh, I can tell the government's two
faced" but then you try to talk to them about religion and they don't want to
hear it because they "fear god's wrath." And I'm like you know, god hasn't been
active in man's life in... thousands and thousands of years, if at all. They
have no problem questioning their government but they don't question their
pastors or their religious leaders or their religious teachers!
It's really amazing to me that the dark ages (laughing) as we had them in the
middle ages... People are saying we should have had the internet and technology
in the 1600's. But with the way that religion carried on and persecuted things
they didn't understand... And look, I know. Change is hard. Change is hard for
ALL of us. But either you do it or it's inevitably forced upon you.
I listen to a lot of comedy, there's a comedian Doug Stanhope, he had a little
bit about, "hey, if somebody had the bible and you were never exposed to it
until you were an adult... would you follow it? Now?" Even in your teens, like
"hey man, check this out, all this stuff is..." you'd be like "Fuck that," you
know? That's why they have to hammer it into your head when you're a little kid
and you think Santa Claus is real, and the Easter Bunny is real, and the Tooth
Fairy is real. It's how they have sheeped us.
It kinda sucks I guess that I wasn't born later in life where (laughing) those
ideas were obsolete because I kinda had to experience those things on my own.
And you know, people are still keeping it alive a little bit here too. I dunno.
I moved past it and I feel better for it.
- I know a lot of times people talk about "be careful once the
knowledge is unveiled." The only thing that is... And I don't even want to say
it's GOOD about religion, but at least religion tries to make some attempt of
giving us some kind of what happens after we die. Because right now, there
hasn't been anybody that I know of who said "hey man, you know, they let me
come back and tell you guys there's this place where everybody goes when they
die" and all that (laughter on both sides). We haven't had any of those kinds
of revelations yet.
I think a lot of people are scared, and rightfully so; nobody wants to die and
nobody wants to think "well shit, I've lived 74 years and this is it." They
want to believe in something. There HAS to be a reason we have that ingrained.
Fuck, I don't wanna die, I wanna know that when I pass on, IF I pass on, that
there's something greater out there waiting. Surely all those people who have
died before me have gone somewhere great.
I think the whole thing about dying forever and never having an existence... I
think I'd rather be burning in hell because at least with burning in hell I
have an existence and I can sense and fear and I can still have human emotion
and contact (he finds this funny here)... Whereas nothingness... I can't fathom
nothingness for eternity...
Well, do you remember what it was like before you were born?
- Right, well, obviously not... But you know...
Yeah, I think that's kinda what it's like. Do you remember what it's like when
you were asleep? (laughing here). I mean when you have dreams and you have a
consciousness when you're asleep, on some level that's when you dream. But when
you DON'T dream you just close your eyes and then boom! you wake up and you're
like "whoah? Did 8 hours just pass" or however long you were asleep. And I kinda
imagine it's just like that. You're just unconscious.
There's theories that you know, reincarnation, where whatever this energy, this
spirit inside of you, as people call it... It transfers on to, say, a squirrel
(laughing here). You know? And then that squirrel gets flattened by a car and
then you become, I dunno... A flower? I don't know how it works but there's all
kinds of theories. You know, I've noticed... When you have children... I've
noticed some things that make me believe a little bit in the passing on of
energy that way. My children, they kinda have their own personalities. Like the
"old soul" kind of thing that people say. You know when you get some 3 year old
kid that can play the drums like John Bonham... You're like "Holy shit, that's
crazy," but maybe there's something to that whole... Maybe your daughter was
John Bonham?! (laughing heavily here).
- Yeah, you gotta wonder about those old Hindu philosophies. These
people; they weren't very technologically advanced obviously, because they
didn't have lasers and microwaves in the 800's or whatever. So you wonder, how
did they learn about the concepts of reincarnation and the soul and things like
that so far back, you gotta wonder.
Yeah. No, it's cool man. Geez, we're getting pretty deep with this interview; I
shoulda gotten really high before I answered this phone (MUCH laughter on both
sides here!) I wasn't really expecting this, I thought it was gonna be like
"yeah, we wrote that song, yeah we played that show, yeah, whatever" and then
it's like "no, man, reincarnation" (more laughter here).
- This is how a lot of my interviews go. We can talk music all day
long, but at the end of the day, the people I talk to... They're people! They
have likes, they have dreams, philosophies, ideologies... This is what the
essence of a LOT of my interviews are like, believe it or not.
Sure, obviously you're inspired to do what you do, and I find that a lot of
people... Because I consider people such as yourself who takes it upon themselves
to show people like "this is music I believe in, I wanna talk to this band and
I wanna share what they have to say." It's a form of art and I feel like it's
much needed as a relationship for artists to have somebody who cares about
artists, and cares about spreading the word. It's fantastic man. So I
appreciate you taking the time to involve us in what you've got going on. It's
very cool.
- Well, we can get back to some (laughing heavily here) music
topics!
Yeah, sure (more laughter here).
- Well, I gotta say, back to the new album... I think my favorite two
songs are 'Brahma Astra' and 'Clawhammer Suicide.' It's like a kick ass one-two
punch. You got catchy choruses you know... I walk around work going "Bombs
AWAY!" Just singing that shit! People look at me like I'm fucking crazy. (MUCH
laughter from Brad). It's HARD to pick favorites tho.
Cool. Thanks. I think a lot of people have kinda latched onto those ones in
particular. People who listen to like you say the chorus. Those have like these
hooks in them. And whenever we write songs, we're not really trying to find a
hook where it's like "okay, man, this is the part where everybody's gonna sing
along." I feel like a lot of arena rockers, bands that have those kinds of
shows... They have the moment in the song where everybody claps along. And then
they throw a key change and it becomes really formulaic and kinda boring. So
whenever we have moments like that, it's an accident but I think it's cool.
(laughing). You know?
- Now, when I look on the Encyclopedia Metallum, they've got you guys
listed as like a stoner metal kind of band. I love stoner rock; I've been
listening to it since Kyuss and Dozer, Natas and all the Man's Ruin Records
releases. Somehow, I kinda see that... And I know a lot of stoner rock bands
have specifically changed their style because... And I guess maybe part of what
I do might be somewhat to blame. But they say "oh, yeah, the journalists just
call us stoner rock, and we're not really stoner rock" and this and that and
the other (I'll skip the whole Amon Amarth part of the conversation here)...
I hear some elements of stoner rock and I hear some metal in there. But
obviously there's a lot more going on below the surface. Do you guys ever get
jaded by seeing "oh, they're calling us stoner rock again." Because I know that
people who are into Man's Ruin releases and now the stuff that's on Small Stone
are obviously gonna dig what you guys are doing.
Yeah. I have noticed that people sorta have a hard time pegging us. It's one
thing or the other, and I think we're not strictly one genre. (laughing) I feel
like we're a crossover band. I've heard people use that term, we sorta mix
styles. We call ourselves stoner/thrash, partly as a joke, but also kinda
partly because I think that's really what's influenced me the most in our
music.
- I saw the shirts! (laughing about their latest T-shirt design).
So yeah, I definitely feel like... There's also some hardcore influence, you
know, like Black Flag, definitely in the vocals. I just kinda roll with it;
whatever people wanna call it is cool. I think some people sort of feel like
they can only listen to a certain style of music in order to stay true to,
whatever they... like they wanna fit in with whatever group of people... It's
like "That's all we listen to, man. All I listen to is Turbonegro! And that's
it!" (laughter here on both sides).
- I hear that a lot in the black metal genre. Especially Scandinavian
black metal. "Oh, if they're using keyboards, it's not cult and true." Hipster
bullshit.
I definitely feel like when you limit yourself to that... You know, that's all
you listen to is that style of music, but there's more out there. And that's
more what our approach is. But those people probably aren't gonna dig what
we're doing. And that's fine. But yeah, the whole genre thing. On this last
record, somebody said we were more like a hair metal band or something like
that and he was really dogging us on the review.
- Wow. Listen to the record!! (laughing here).
Back when I was younger, my brother was a big hair metal guy and he used to
bring all that shit home and I'd drum along to it. I'd say I've got some Motley
Crue influence in there some where. There's still some bands I'm really into
from that era. Like Badlands, they're a really good band. Jake E. Lee he's an
amazing guitar player, he's one of my biggest favorites I guess, on guitar.
- Now, it's funny you mention Jake E. Lee, because... Everybody's
gonna swear by Randy Rhoads, but personally, man, I thought Jake E. Lee had the
better, more emotionally crafted riffs. Don't get me wrong, I'm not taking
anything away from Rhoads, but "The Ultimate Sin..." That's why I went to go
see Jake E. Lee when he came to town. To me that is still THE quintessential
Ozzy album and I STILL feel that way to this day.
Yeah. So I really dig Jake E. Lee too, and Randy Rhoads was great, but I dunno,
Jake E. Lee for some reason... He's got the whole technical end of things down,
but he's also got a very musical approach to what he's doing? It's kinda weird
when somebody's shredding, a lot of times you can't really "hum along," you
know? Like you don't hear it, all you're hearing is just "yeah, that guy plays
fast." But HE, like it fits whenever he's playing solos. He's SAYING something,
you know?
I was just having a conversation with somebody about Zakk Wylde vs. Jake E.
Lee the other day. You know, Zakk's talented, don't get me wrong, but sing
along to one of the solos! (laughing). It's all just a bunch of nonsense, you
know?
- To me, a GOOD lead soloist isn't just one that can crank out 450
notes a minute or do these wild bends. One thing I love about Scandinavian
black metal, especially guitar wise... Man, they really use the FUCK outta
those last three strings on a guitar man. And doom metal does that too; just
really emotionally crafted notes that you HEAR something beyond just A, B, G,
F, E, G, G in there. You can hear the SOUL of the artist in those strings, in
that technique, I think.
That's something I have come to discover later on in my time on guitars. I have
been concentrating for so many years on trying to find the perfect guitar TONE,
and buying the correct gear to get the sound you want. You hear the bands that
sound the way that you imagine YOU want to sound and you look at what they're
playing through and you examine their techniques. You know, you put a lot of
work into it that way.
But then, when you're sitting there and you're coming up with some new
material... It's like man, you gotta play a little quieter, turn the volume
knob down a little bit. And the way you pick and the way you fret those notes,
you get really expressive once you turn the volume down. I started getting into
bands... One that comes to mind right now is a band we've had the opportunity
to play with a couple of times, Earth? They're awesome, and they're pretty
minimalist with what they've got going on. Like they can take a lick and just
streeeetch it out over like 10 minutes. It kinda puts you in a trance; it's
really cool. I can't think of any band right now that really sounds like them,
they've got their own thing going, and I really respect that.
I notice things; a little bit from here and a little bit from there. And that's
how we end up with saxophone solos in our songs, I guess (laughter on both
sides).
- Well, we gotta start wrapping things up. Obviously I'm a newcomer
to you guys, and wow, 15 years of history I've missed out on. I'm looking at
some of your other full releases... What are some of your other albums and
recordings like, how would you compare, say (laughing at this album title) "All
Your Chicks Are Belong To Us," and "Fatal Error" and "Must Destroy." How would
you compare those three to the newest record?
Well, the older stuff, when we first started out we were... Tony and I were
jamming for awhile, and I was very new to playing guitar. Like I'd only been
playing guitar for maybe two or three years at that point. So a lot of the
songs I was writing were not very intricate. I would say when we first started
out we were kinda more like a hard rock, punk sort of band. And I would say
that first record is very in that vein. Metal, some metal in there too. But I
kinda wanted to start simple with the band.
When I write songs, I kinda have the whole album in mind. Like "Okay, this
album, this is what we wanna say, this is what we wanna do. This song leads
into that song." It just becomes kind of a work of art. That's just my approach
to it, or my theory behind it. It was pretty simple and straightforward. And
then with the next record, I was like "okay, let's kinda expand on this sound
and throw some different grooves at them, different time signatures and play
around a little bit with what we got going on." But it still had that same
sort of flavor. A lot of those albums were also really low budget productions
recorded in jam spaces in basements, and wherever we could get some recording
time for free or cheap.
So this last record, though, we had so many opportunities open up to us even
though we didn't really have a lot of money, we've been doing this for so many
years and playing different shows. We played some of the biggest shows we've
ever had on this last record we did which was "Must Destroy." And "Must
Destroy" we kinda started settling into "a sound," which we are still sort of
evolving a little bit here and there. But still, that record was recorded on a
budget... It turned out the way it did. Not disappointed in it or anything like
that, but I felt like we needed to step it up with the production. So we hired
like an actual, uh, "professional." I'm gonna use that word kinda loosely
(laughter here - Ed). but that's what the guy does for a living; he is a
professional sound engineer. He did a fantastic job of finding the right sound
for our songs.
This record "Sci Fi Or Die," we approached it COMPLETELY different than how we
have done any record we've done in the past. All those records were just kinda
like "Okay, take one!" boom, "Alright sounds good!" He was like "okay, can you
do it..." He kinda set me down and was like "Play perfectly!" (laughter here
again on all sides). And I was like "Nobody EVER expected me to play perfectly
before!" And that was kinda cool! He got us to focus a little bit more on our
performance. And yeah, I am an imperfect in how I play, so it was VERY
challenging to kinda... be perfect. But you could hear EVERTHING clearly and
that's what we WANT. All of our albums previously to this one, were pretty raw
in their approach, and this one.. If you take this album and put it up against
any national release, I'd say it holds up pretty well. If I do say so myself,
and it's not because of what WE did, it's because of what HE did.
His name is Mark Whitcomb, and he owns DNA Music Studios, or Sound Labs I think
they call it here in Madison. I loved working with him and I think we'll
probably work with him again on our next album.
- Finally, I know there's not a whole lot of bands that come out of
Wisconsin, but the few that I have... Incredible quality. One band that I
always refer to quite a bit is Aphotic. I did the last ever interview with that
band and he was like "We spent all those years trying to get on a label" and
this and that and the other. It was SO heartbreaking to realize that I would be
the LAST publication that would ever talk to this band.
It seems like every day I hear stories about great bands that I absolutely fall
in love with that... Another one, trying to remember what their name was. They
did a Pentagram cover... They were a GREAT doom metal band, they sounded like
if doom metal was written in the Old West kinda thing, very original. Earthen
Grave, that's it. Just a shame. Maybe you guys can be the Wisconsin band that
kinda breaks out and gets well known worldwide and does really well. (I was
UN-saying that these were bands that just called it quits and stopped being a
band).
Yeah, I mean if that happens, that would be great. We're up for it (laughing)
but it's not like the ultimate goal. Like what we're after. As long as we're
inspired to create and inspired to perform we're gonna do it. We all have our
own lives though; I've got my kids, I've got my family. I have a business I run
and the band kinda happens AROUND all of that. If opportunities build up for
the band and we have the time and the energy to devote to it; we love it, so
yeah, we would probably pursue that! Until that happens, though, we're just
gonna keep doing what we're doing.
You know, a lot of times too, when you have that level of success, I noticed it
kinda fucks things up for bands. You get bands like... Ah, Jesus.. You know,
like Black Sabbath! "Hey, Black Sabbath, you know, sales are down, and I think
it's time Ozzy that you go solo. And uh, the rest of you guys, you know,
whatever... If it happens to you, great." (laughing). Say what you want about
the non-Ozzy Sabbath years, I think they are still a great band and have
awesome material. But that's the first one I could think of off the top of my
head. Things start getting fucked up I think when you start putting money into
it and people get distracted by the business end of things instead of just "hey
we're a bunch of dudes that just like playing together." We are creatively
motivated.
But hey, if that happens to us dude, and I'm sitting on a pile of money then
great! (laughing). I doubt that's ever gonna happen, though, man. It's not like
we're playing anything that the masses really wanna chew up!
- Have you guys ever played down here in Atlanta?
Yeah, man, we played a show down in Atlanta! That was a crazy fucking night too
man! We played a gig down there; I can't remember the name of the space. It was
across the street from The Earl. I remember we were hanging out at The Earl and
going "Man, I wish we were playing at this place, this place rules!" But
anyway, we played the show that we played, and the sound guy was like "You guys
can crash at my house. We're gonna have a party and there's gonna be girls
there. You gotta be really, be respectful to the women." And he kept saying
that again and again, like "You need to be respectful." And I'm like "we're
respectful, dude, we LOVE women!" Cool. Like "Thanks for having us, we won't
fuck around."
So we get to the dude's house and yeah, there's a party there. And the guy had
like a tattoo parlor built into their kitchen, like they put up some drywall.
There's all these people drinking and listening to loud music and we're kinda
just chilling, like "Oh, man I'm gonna get some sleep." And all of a sudden I
hear a ruckus in the other room, and I go to check it out. And it's some dude
breaking down that tattoo parlor with his fist, like he's punching through the
drywall and he's ripping it apart. And then some other dude joins in and they
just start demolishing this thing. And I'm just like "Man, I dunno what these
guys are doing," but there's a crowd gathered around it and there's some
drama. And I'm just like "I just wanna go to sleep."
So I go into the other room and try to go to sleep, and next thing I know those
dudes start pushing each other and it's turned into a fight. And I'm just like
"fuck dude!" And we're in the middle of some kinda weird suburban neighborhood.
And they go out rolling out into the front yard and the whole crowd is out
there. And it's like 3 or 4 in the morning. I'm like "fuck it, I'm sleeping in
the van!" (MUCH laughter here on both sides). Because the cops are gonna come
here and I don't really wanna deal with any of this shit. But yeah, Atlanta was
crazy man!
- I think the club you're talking about is the 529. Because that's
the only club I know of that is right next to the Earl. I've been to shows
there. The sound guy is like in a closet or something (laughing here).
Um, it's possible. The stage was up a flight of stairs and it wasn't really
very roomy. So it was easy to pack the place that we were playing, it felt like
a bigger show than it really was! (laughing). And I remember the stage had a
wierd little... You open up a trap door and you load in from behind the back
stage area with like some stairs. And you lift the trap foor and you're right
on stage. It was weird.
It was fun man; the guy who booked us really liked us and treated us really
well. The people, yeah they were raging, but they were cool. But I was just
like, man, I don't like that redneck shit where people are bumping chests and
breaking shit. It's not my scene.
- Do you remember who you played with?
Uh, we actually played with a band from Florida, they're called Rojo Diablo.
They were the only other band on the bill.
- We gotta get you guys back down here!
Sure, yeah! I loved Atlanta, man, it was fun visiting. I liked exploring the
city. I love that Southern area down there. We played, geez, where else did we
play? We played Nashville, North Carolina, I dunno... Florida. It's beautiful
down there.
HOBBS ANGEL OF DEATH.
Interview with Peter Hobbs via facebook chat.
Damn if yet ANOTHER favorite band of mine from the 80's isn't being
interviewed in this issue! The "Australian Slayer" put out a massively CRUSHING
album with their self titled release, and they are still going strong today.
Well, sort of. Like Bruce Corbitt of Warbeast/Rigor Mortis, Peter Hobbs isn't
doing so well today health wise. But we hope he crushes all that and returns to
the U.S. to slay us poseurs once again, for experiencing Hobbs' live is the
ULTIMATE aphrodisiac for us 80's metal fans. Having seen them once, I wouldn't
DARE miss them again!
- Just wanted to say, it's a shame you had to cancel that U.S. tour
last year.
Yeah, I've had a lot of health issues lately. We had to do the same with Europe
this year.
- It seemed like this was the year that Hobbs Angel Of Death was
starting to get known. It seems like a lot of 80's metal bands are finally
starting to getting the respect they deserve: I guess it's because the kids
these days are getting sick and tired of the kind of shit metal that seems to
permeate the scene these days.
There's so many bands around now, bro. I dunno, I think people are just wanting
to be in a band to think that they're cool. It's flooding the market. There's
some great things out there. I dunno, sometimes I think it's more cool NOT to
be in a band nowadays.
- Australia has always had some great underground metal bands. I
guess being so isolated and being so far from everyone else put a damper on
things. There's bands like Mortal Sin, and bands out now that are doing well
like Destroyer 666 and what not. It just seems like Australia is just so
geographically isolated, it's hard to put things together. And I guess the
expense of travelling to and from also probably plays a lot in that.
Well that's always been my issue anyway, because the distance is far. We're
13,000 miles from Europe, you know what I mean? It's a fair distance. Like
bands coming to here, depends on promoters, whatever. But it's gonna cost! Like
the minimum air fare from Europe to Australia is $1800 you know?
- It's kinda cool that Hells' Headbanger Records got interested in
Hobbs Angel Of Death. Was that as a result of touring or were they able to hear
the stuff that you had for the "Heaven Bled" album?
Well, I met Chase out at Massachusetts. And we had a good talk about it and
everything. He heard a few of the album tracks live. So he heard that and I did
the deal with Hells Headbangers, I never even heard the album, and the same
with Rockstack in Japan. And the deal was done, the material was sent to them,
and I said "this is how the track listings I want, I want it to run like this,"
the artwork. And boom, we signed the deals and then it was released. It's still
getting talked about; it's a great album, I've got great people on it with me.
I produced it myself; I knew exactly what I wanted.
- I figure all those years in the music business, you've been at this
a long time. When you went into making the album "Heaven Bled," what did you
decide had to be done differently? Obviously the songs are a bit slowed down,
there's not the out and out speedier tracks. The influence is still there; you
still hear the first album but it goes in a different direction. I understand
bands when they say "I don't want to make "Reign In Blood 2" or "Pleasure To
Kill" all over again."
Look, I had a lot of songs form the 80's and 90's that I had kicking around in
my head. And I thought "okay, that's what I was doing back then." I'll reinvent
these and let's see what I can come up with. There were quite a few songs I
already had in my head and I just revamped them. I wanted a wider variety of
people to be listening to my music. I'm into so many other bands; I enjoy so
much other stuff, that I give back to the industry what influenced me. So there
is some Judas Priest in there, some Motorhead, and Black Sabbath in there.
There's some black metal in there as well. It was my gift back to the industry.
- I realize too, as a teenager getting into metal for the first time,
I don't think in exactly the same ways that I do now. Of course, you still see
the rants, you know, "Aww, fuck this shit, I'm pissed off about that..." But it
seems like a lot of the metal people, as they get older... I don't want to say
they've tempered, or they've mellowed. But it seems like they have a certain
kind of wisdom to them you don't find in the mainstream crowd. Writing these
types of lyrics and expressing these types of emotions and opinions kinda opens
you up to a wide range of lyrical and topical influences.
You can't stay the same forever. The world has gotta go around. I see all this
bullshit on facebook about all these people with opinions... Look, it's all up
to the individual. If you're not liking what you're doing today, then move on
and do what you've gotta do; broaden your horizons. You HAVE to move forward.
Of course, maturity plays a big part in life; the things that you liked before
are not interesting today. That change is always there, and I find it exciting
too, to take on new challenges and things you haven't done before.
- Obviously, from an early age, there was a lot of vitriol towards
the church and religion, because we realized it's just basically blinding
control through fear. But a lot of people wonder DOES extreme metal have a
place for positivity: you know, positive lyrics, positive ideas and influences.
Obviously people can say, well, you know "We've been rehasing Satanism for over
40 years" but is like death and black metal; is that really the place where
positivity can be embraced and even championed so to speak.
Music is music... It depends on which audiences you are trying to gain, or
even... Not so much preach, but who you are playing to and everything. Look, I
think there's a possibility, why can't there be? But not in a way... I don't
name drop or anything... I mean if your name was Stryper, what would you be
singing about? The people that go to see them, wouldn't like to see me. And
vice versa. That's just how it is, but look, everything has possibilities.
- And the lyrics you wrote, a lot of hatred for the church, and I'm
with you on that path. I always saw christianity as a blinding, enslaving tool.
But some people NEED that, sadly, because they're not able to see outside the
box and think for themselves. But when I look at some of the lyrics you've
written on this new album and the ones you wrote in the past, they're kind of
along the same path. Your core beliefs and principles seem to still be intact.
That's how I see it anyway.
Well, I'm a man of my word; I believe in a gentleman's handshake and
agreements. You can't run around the world saying and doing one thing, and then
being a hypocrite in another. Like a few of these bands that have turned around
and say "I've seen god!" And becoming a born again christian. And I'm thinking
to myself "why the fuck would you do that?" Because you're not happy within
yourself.
- I've read that in the press; Blackie Lawless from W.A.S.P. is a
staunch defender of christianity. I'm kinda feeling some of the residual
effects of age. I think a lot of these people just want some guarantee of where
they're going to end up when they die. Because you know, all the religions say
either you're gonna burn in hell, or you're gonna go to heaven or live in
paradise on earth, or be reincarnated... Nobody fuckin' knows what's going to
happen after death. Me personally, I just wanna know that there's some kinda of
positive existence that goes on after this one. There's all kinds of theories
about, you know, aliens created us, we're a race from the stars, blah blah
blah. I think these people are scared of their own mortality, maybe they
realize that their life is soon to be over and they're desperate; they're
clinging... And death is a pretty scary thing to be honest with ya.
I just recently have been in the hospital and in a pretty bad way. Like my
health issues and that. Well, the Grim Reaper visited me quite a few times. And
sometimes there where I did pass away. Oh, man, I fuckin' went to heaven! I got
up there and I looked to these gates, and I looked through the fence, right? I
saw all the fuckin' assholes I didn't like down here! And I thought, there's no
fuckin' way I'm coming up here, I'm going back down there. So I actually went
back and visited hell too. And this guy said to me, "no, I got too much work
for you up there. You're too much competition, you're balls fuckin' chaos down
here, so fuck off."
But that's a bit of a joke, but thats the way I saw it, you know? We don't know
where we're going, but let's say I came very, very close and still day by day.
I'm still battling these issues. At the end of the day, wherever we go, we
deserved it wherever we're going. Same as the consequences when we're told,
like the issues with me with my lungs, liver and heart at the moment. I was
told many years ago; stop smoking, stop drinking, stop doing all this bad shit
you do. It will catch up. "Ah, bullshit, it's my body, I know what I'm doing."
So, I think at the end of the day, we have to try and do what we gotta do to
stay on here as long as we can to annoy the shit outta people that don't like
us! (laughing here). And the people that do like us, the ones that we love, and
vice-versa, we gotta try and help them too. As for wherever we go, if we've
done a good job on this when we DO go, I think at the end of the day, I think
we're all gonna end up going to all our different places. I think a nice
holiday, a resort permanently would suit me! (laughs).
- So when you were kicking around in the early 80's, what kinda bands
were you into? I know Mortal Sin was just starting out; A lot of people have
compared Hobbs' first album to some of Slayer's best work. We do a lot with
rare and out of print 80's metal at the magazine. I'm just curious if any of
that ever ran across your desk; did you ever hear any 80's metal bands that
nobody knew about that you thought "Aw, fuck, man, these guys should be bigger
than they are."
Aw man, back in the time I used to love Artillery and their "Terror Squad"
album. That was just absolutely awesome. But now they're on a lot of festivals
now. There was a lot of bands, there was just so many. But yeah, of course we
got labeled the Australian Slayer. I had the opportunity to meet Kerry King
when I played in Finland, in Oulu. The promoter was a fan of both Hobbs and
Slayer. And on purpose he put us on, so we were right before Slayer. And we had
to cross paths in the corridor. I met Kerry and I spoke to him. He goes "yes, I
do know you and I've heard of you before." I said "look, I've been labeled the
Australian Slayer, even tonight when we played they MENTIONED that, and
introduced Hobbs Angel Of Death as the Australian Slayer." (laughs). I said
"What do you feel about that?" He goes, "nah, man. Everybody's influenced by
somebody. But I heard what you were doing. And you're Hobbs Angel Of Death. And
that's it." You know what I mean? So it was good to hear it from him personally.
Let's say the song 'Hypocrites.' There's a Slayer'y feel there. A lot of people
think that I sound like Tom Araya in some parts as well. But maybe Tom Araya...
sounds like me! Because we're the same age. Tyrus was around too when Slayer
was more or less just starting as well. The band I had before Hobbs Angel Of
Death.
- So what advice would you give to musicians that are just starting
out? You know there's probably some kids somewhere that are going "Ah, you know
man, we like Hobbs Angel Of Death; we like Slayer, we kinda wanna do that kind
of thing." You've been around the business a long time, you and I both have
seen the business change, both for better and for worse.
She's changed that much now... Personally, my opinion to this... I've spoken to
a lot of young people. It's all about sacrifice. It doesn't come to you for
free, and it doesn't come to you on a silver platter. You have to put the time
in. There's no such thing as "pay to play." You earn the merit, and the merit
is what will lead and get you up that ladder, further. I've always tried to
support other bands, I've never pegged anybody or whatever. Because there's
always room to make improvements with your units in the bands. Always be nice
to people on the way up because you normally see them on the way down. It's a
matter of getting out there and doing what you have to do.
I know the industry has changed, and a lot of people... What do they call it?
Fund me stuff... Whatever it's called.
- Like the crowdfunding thing?
Aw, man... That is just bullshit. All that is doing is asking somebody to pay
your gas bills, and your electricity bills and buy your champagne when you're
pissing it up against the wall. If you can't make the sacrifices and leave your
jobs, like I did. I left my jobs all the time and come back with nothing and
starting again. These people that want to go and do things, and wanna keep
their jobs... and have FANS... pay bills? That is the most disgusting thing
I've ever fucking heard of...
- I guess you and I see crowdfunding... well, certain types of
crowdfunding, in a different way. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with
it if the people who are doing it are actually giving back. Yeah, just sitting
around and saying "yeah, pay my bills and give me money while I do what I do,"
that's kinda fucked up. But if you look back to medieval times, people like
Michaelangelo, Leonardo DaVinci, they had patrons. You think about how long it
took Michaelangelo to paint the Sistine Chapel, artists and painter and
sculptors had patrons that supported them and they had these great works of
art." (long pause from Hobbs' here, and I think he's thinking about this).
I guess I just kinda see that on a different plane. The whole point of this is
you're supposed to be giving back to your fans and your crowd. I think it
should be a reciprocal thing; you should be able to give them something that
they can't get elsewhere. I think artists are realizing that they don't to go
the traditional record label route anymore. A lot of them are just doing it
online and they have their websites and their fan pages; they're just kinda
networking that way.
Yeah. It's their own thing. I just... I'm a person that's um, not scared to
make the sacrifices no matter what. Either it's on or it's off. To be a
freeloader, in a few things? That's not cool. That's what I've been saying to a
lot of people, younger generation. It's cool because I've got guys that play
with me and have played with me and they've got kids now, themselves today
playing in bands. And they said, "What's the best way of attacking this pig?
You know?" I said, bro, never pay to play, always stand your ground, and never
be bored. In the end you'll work out what your value is, and the fans will let
you know what your value is. You can't please everybody, ya know?
- So you have any other plans? Are you working on another record
right now; you have any songs in the works, or are you just kinda kicking back
and seeing where this goes?
At the moment, I'm full bore resting. I have no choice. I had to cancel this
European tour because the doctors and hospitals just won't let me fly. It's
more or less "fly... you will die." I don't take things very easy. I thought I
was Superman; unfortunately I learned the hard way. So I really have to
recuperate. It's gonna take some time; I've had to turn my life 180 degrees.
The drinking and the smoking had to stop immediately. I very heavily damaged my
internal organs. There's no tour for me at the moment, but I've changed my ways
and tried to do what I possibly can.
Because I miss you guys, I want to come back to America. I was MEANT to be
coming this year! (2017) Whoever would have thought that this would all
happened, but it does. So to all my fans out there and to all my good friends,
I apologize for not being able to fulfill my obligations. But being the good
friends that you are, and understanding. They understood the seriousness of
this for me to stay back here in Australia. And they also know that I'm doing
my best to get it all back together again, and hopefully get out and do some
touring again and do what I've got to do. I've got great support from my
promoters, and the guys that play with me.
Just like the European thing, they said to me, "We waited and we waited until
your final decision." And they KNOW that I'm a stubborn bull, and I try and do
the ultimate. But even they said "there's no way in the world you can attempt
to get on that plane and come over here." Which is good, I mean that's pure
honesty, and that's real humanity. Humans! Because they weren't thinking of
themselves, they were thinking of me and us as a unit. Which was really cool.
Because at the end of the day, I might make it there, but halfway through the
tour you might kick the fucking bucket on stage! It's not a cool thing. I got a
lot of respect for the people I play with.
- You know, it's funny... Lemmy from Motorhead. He practically... I
mean, I won't say he died onstage, but he was just like "I'm going to go out
there everyday." And I wonder, if he had actually, maybe kinda slowed it down a
little bit maybe we would have had him another 5 or 10 years longer.
You wonder.
Um, look, I think he had issues as well. I remember seeing him playing and he
just said "I can't do this." And I just thought, how sad. Because the will and
the want was there to do it. But at the end of the day, when the body says
"fuck it, I've had enough," that's like me. I made my way to the hospital and
my heart just stopped. And from that day now, I knew that this is not a feeling
I've got a hangover, I'm not feeling good. I mean that's been building up for a
long time. When your heart just stops... Pretty scary shit.
The body's actually telling you "for fuck's sake, you haven't changed the oil
in a hundred years. Personally I think we all sit around and we relax and we
think "what sort of age do I want to live to?" I've heard people say "ah, 60
will do mate. Or 70, 80's okay." The way I see it today, fucking hell, if I can
be sort of on the ball and still think, and not have dementia... Fuck I'd like
to live to be a hundred and sixty seven!
- Hell, we all do!
Another hundred years would be nice.
- Hell, TWO hundred! (laughing here).
Of course. But I do realize, to have that extra length in life of today, it
needs to be done with health and care. It's not the same as it was before; all
this shit that we... Everything that comes in a box or plastic is fucked! Sadly
even a lot of the fruit, a lot of the vegetables, everything; it's all
cultivated, they use chemicals to make it grow faster.
- We're being poisoned basically. You hit the nail on the head. You
can't eat anything anymore that doesn't have sugar or gluten in it. People say
"ah, it's a conspiracy; they're trying to kill us, they're trying to posion us,
they're trying to decrease the population of the earth faster." But really,
what it is; it's just businesses that were just trying to find a way to get
more product out there, make it last longer and make it cheaper. It's business
101 really.
I think sometimes these conspiracy theorists go overboard. BUT... At the same
time, just like I think with a lot of religion, there's a middle ground in
there somewhere where there's an underlying overtone of truth that's kinda
gotten to be dug to to get through all the bullshit.
Definitely... Definitely agree with that statement.
- So what did you find that was different just being in the U.S. as
opposed to being in Australia?
There's no kangaroos!! (laughter here on both sides - Ed.). It's an eye opener.
We've got a lot of open space here too. America is really weird, like you leave
one town and go to another one. The accent is different, the mannerism is all
different, like going from L.A. to Tampa, or L.A. to New York. It's so
different. If I remember you guys were in Atlanta, yeah? It was really cool,
though, and we had a good crew. It was really, really cool.
- Well, Peter, I am very greatful to you for doing this interview,
this is an interview I've wanted to do for about 25 years! (laughing here).
It's my pleasure, actually my thankfulness and respect goes to people like
yourself. Because at the end of the day, without the media, without the fans,
without all the things in the industry, I don't exist. So my hat goes off to
you guys. You're actually giving YOUR time to me. It's all good. And hopefully
I'll keep working on all these issues and I'll be back in the USA! I miss it, I
love being in the US!
MANILLA ROAD.
Interview with Mark Shelton at The Basement in Atlanta.
This truly is a remarkable issue. A THIRD 80's metal band I've been
into for quite awhile, this interview was done on their 40th anniversary tour,
making them probably THE longest running metal band interviewed in this issue.
And like Hobbs Angel of Death, thanks to Mr. Amos Rifkin for bringing them down
here. Lots of great stories to tell from the old days, there aren't many around
these days, those living legends like Mark "The Shark" Shelton.
NOTE: At the time of this writing, Mark Shelton passed away from a heart attack
while in Germany on July 27th, days before this issue was to go to press. VERY
fucking sad for me to think this is the last Manilla Road interview ANYONE will
EVER read...
- Hell, let's go all the way back to the beginning... Probably two of
the rarest Manilla Road albums are the "Metal" and "Invasion" titles.
Well, it could be; they're sorta rare. We put them out originally on our own
label because we couldn't find a label back then. Nobody was interested in us,
we sent so many demos out to all the majors and all the labels that we could
think of. Nobody took us on it so we decided well, I guess we're going to have
to do it ourselves, because we weren't of a mind to just give it up at that
time. Sometimes you wouldn't even hear back from them, but every once in awhile
we'd get a nice letter saying "hey, thank you for sending this stuff, you're
just really not what we're looking for right now, but keep us informed and what
your status is." Which a nice way of saying "yeah, we don't like you guys."
(laughing).
- When I listen to those early albums, there's all kinds of stuff in
there; there's a little bit of space rock, there's some traditional 70's rock.
Where was your head at when you started creating these two albums, and what
kind of influences were you checking out when you did these?
I definitely was influenced by bands like early U.F.O., Scorpions, Jimi
Hendrix, Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Uriah Heep, Hawkwind, Pink Floyd. Lots of
sort of psychedelic type roots going on there. I was raised in Kansas, and the
predominant music force in rock and roll there was country rock. So I had a lot
of influences from ZZ Top, Lynyrd Skynrd, Atlanta Rhythm Section... Oh, Atlanta
Rhythm Section!!! (both of us laughing here, since Mark is IN Atlanta at the
time)
You know things like that. All of those things were highly influential. I think
that and smoking a lot of weed (laughing) probably contributed to the
psychedelic nature of the band. We slowly progressed out of that as the music
scene and the metal scene got heavier. Because when we started really, metal
wasn't a big thing. I actually got the term heavy metal from the French
magazine Metal Hurlant, which means Heavy Metal in French. Then later on it got
published in America as Heavy Metal, and eventually the two movies came out and
everything. So that was sort of my description in my head about what heavy
metal music should be about at the beginning. It's science fiction, fantasy,
adventure, that type of stuff which was all encompassed in the magazine itself.
That was probably another really big influence as to where I was going with the
music.
We were asked all the time what kind of music do you play and we had no clue of
what to tell everybody. All I knew was it had this epic nature, because I was
really influenced by bands like Rush and things like 'By-Tor And The Snow Dog'
to me is a really epic song. All of the stuff on "Caress Of Steel" you know,
'Fountain Of Lamneth,' and 'The Necromancer' especially is one of my alltime
favorite epic tunes. That along with Michael Moorcock doing lyrics for Hawkwind
and stuff... Because I was big into Elric and really big into Robert E. Howard
and Conan. So all that stuff played into the ideas of what we were going for.
My guitar style, when I'm asked about that, I'd have to say it's a combination
of a plethora of guitar players over the years that I really like that I stole
little bits and pieces and tricks from... And then musical training. The list
is too long to name, I could start naming guitar players that are my idols, but
it turns into 100+ after awhile. But every one of those guys had some little
fraction to do with helping me developing the style that I had. And I was always
after a fusionary type idea; massing different styles of heavy music together
to come up with a unique style. It's epic and it's metal, and so eventually
that turned into epic metal.
- I'm curious now, the first time I ever heard the two albums was the
Reborn bootleg classic with the two albums on one CD, and I know they left off
the track 'Centurian War Games.'
Yeah, they did leave off 'Centurian War Games.' I think it was just a matter of
space. They didn't have time, and like you said it was a bootleg, so maybe it
was their way of making it look like it wasn't a bootleg, I dunno (laughs). We
actually put out all that stuff originally on our own label. And very limited
copies were pressed, probably in the neighborhood of 2 to 3 thousand each
pressing. It wasn't until "Crystal Logic" that we pressed a lot more.
I think the thing that really launched us into the metal network was when we
did 'Flaming Metal Systems' on the U.S. Metal Volume 3 compilation with Mike
Varney from Shrapnel Records. That sort of broke us in the international scene.
Because right after that when we put out "Crystal Logic" ourselves, Mike
Varney actually offered me a contract but he didn't like the "Crystal Logic"
album; we had already finished it when I met with him out in San Francisco out
in the Bay Area. And he listened to the tape, all of the album, he listened to
the whole album! He told me he really liked the intro, the prologue, which is
like a minute and a half. He said that is just as killer as can be, but
everything else on the album sorta sucks, I don't really like it. I was like
"really?" He said, "But I tell ya what, I'll cut you a contract right now, I
mean we can do the deal right now, if you promise to give me a whole album's
worth of 'Flaming Metal System' style music.
And I thought about it for about 3 seconds and told him no. I said, "You know,
I've already finished "Crystal Logic" and I really like it. I think this is
what I want to push, I don't want to do 10 songs of 'Flaming Metal Systems.'
- It's kinda funny you mention that, because MOST of that album
sounds like 'Flaming Metal Systems,' so I don't see where he was getting at
with that! (laughing here).
I don't either. I mean they were all done in the same period of time; we were
finishing up the album ("Crystal Logic") when he signed us to do the song for
the compilation album. And I wrote the song 'Flaming Metal Systems'
SPECIFICALLY for that release. That's why you have the reference to 'When the
shrapnel flies' and stuff like that. Always working with metaphors; it's a
trait of mine, probably a bad trait (laughs). I didn't understand why he didn't
like the rest of the album either? And I've always wondered what he thinks now
since it's our most iconic release ever...
- Exactly. And it's funny too, because you guys were on Black Dragon
records for quite awhile. I'm guessing that was just a licensing deal that you
had?
It was contract by contract; each contract was one in itself. It wasn't like
they signed us for multiple albums.
- Which is unusual, because that's (not) usually what you hear from
most artists from the 80's on up.
Right. Well, first of all, they were just getting started as a label, and they
were new to the business. They didn't really have the equation in their mind I
guess from all the other labels, they just didn't know. The first one they did
with us was "Open The Gates" and it was a huge success for them. And for us
too, we made a lot of money on that one just right away. And "The Deluge" came
out the same way and they just kept signing us because we were selling well for
them. I have a feeling we were... maybe... the best selling band band they had
at that time.
- I can believe that! (laughs).
You know, things went really well with them but eventually they lost their
distribution because their main distributor they had in France, New Rose
distribution, got shut down for some reason. We had heard rumours that they had
ties to the Black Market, or Mafia, or whatever in France; I don't know if
that's true or not, but it's just what we heard. But when they lost that
distribution they tried to do the distro themselves, and they did something
that made the people at Important Records mad, and so Important Records just
blackballed them in the industry. And strangely enough, we got blackballed too
along with them because we were on that label.
After we were done with Black Dragon, and they really just couldn't do anything
to help us anymore, we had a really difficult time finding a label to work with
because of all that was going on. When we went to do "Courts Of Chaos," which
was pretty much the last official Manilla Road album in my mind with Black
Dragon, Important wouldn't put it out. David Chastain ended up talking
Important into releasing it, as long as they didn't put Manilla Road on it, and
so it came out with my name only on it.
- Yeah, I was wondering why Manilla Road didn't continue on with the
name for several albums.
We were actually broken up after "Courts Of Chaos," and I put together a band
called Circus Maximus. And we sold that one off to Black Dragon too, which was
the absolute last album I gave them. The final straw with me and them was that
they decided it needed to be a Manilla Road album even though it wasn't, so
that it would sell. And it doesn't even sound like a Manilla Road album...
Maybe one or two songs does, a little bit, but it was definitely a different
band. So that was my last dealings with Black Dragon.
Then we were signed, for a minute, with David Chastain's label Leviathan
Records, which we put "Out Of The Abyss" on. And that actually did okay,
because he had pretty good distribution and everything. But it was just right
after that that the thing with Black Dragon happened with Important, and it
became really difficult. And I did the Circus Maximus thing up until about '93
I think? We always knew that was just sort of a "do it for now, it's not going
to last" type of thing. We never considered making it a long term project.
At that point, Randy Fox and I got back together, and we did a bunch of songs
that we were writing. Brian's brother Harvey Patrick came on to start playing
bass with us. We did lots of shows in our area, but once again we couldn't get
a label interested in us. It wasn't until 2000 that I finally got contacted by
a label in Germany, Iron Glory Records. They were looking to reissue the
"Crystal Logic" album. Of course, we'd never toured in Europe, so we had no
clue what was going on over there. There was this huge rise of fanbase over in
Europe that was happening that we didn't know was happening.
- I don't know about "rise," but Europe has always been clued in to
metal. When we had grunge and the supposed death of metal Europe was like
"What's that!?" (laughing). They've always been diehards.
In the last few years, it got lumped in to being one of those classic albums
in that range of time.
- Oh you got a LOT of classic albums in that range!
Oh, Thank you!
- Speaking of remasters and reissues though... It's so weird to me
that it took so long; I think Sonic Age reissued the "Metal" and "Invasion"
albums. They didn't remove any of the vinyl noise! I remaster a lot of the 80's
metal vinyl that's on my site. And to me, it's like you have to AT LEAST remove
the vinyl noise. That's my biggest thing in remasters and it annoys me to no
end that labels are putting this stuff out and not cleaning it properly.
Yeah, that's always an issue, and you see, they didn't have good master tapes
to work off of on that.
- Where did they get the masters?
I think they actually took it off of an LP. That's why it has vinyl noise on
it.
- Ah okay, that would explain things. You don't have the master tapes
to those?
They eventually got used I think for the reissues that we did with Golden Core
Records. This is the label that we've been signed to for the last several
years, that our last three new albums "Mysterium," "The Blessed Curse," and our
newest one "To Kill A King" are out on. They're doing a reissue campaign that's
been ongoing and still ongoing at this point. They're putting out like 10 or 11
of our albums.
- Has "Metal" and "Invasion" been done yet?
They have been done and they are available, and everything up to... I think
"Out Of The Abyss" is the next one that they're doing now.
- Yeah, the Sonic Age version, I've actually got that in the car. The
"missing track" 'Centurion War Games' to me, that sounds like it was recorded
later, it doesn't sound like it was lifted from the master tapes... That's kind
of a curious story to me. (laughing). Maybe it's just the way I listen to it, I
dunno.
I'm not sure. It was actually recorded at the same time as the "Invasion"
album. Maybe the uniqueness of it is because it's an acoustic song. Maybe
that's why it doesn't have some of the other noise on it or whatever. I
dunno. 'Cause you wouldn't have any amp noise...
When we first started doing those albums, we were recording in a very small
studio in a basement that was just getting started itself. As we grew, the
studio itself grew. And I think that's because every time we recorded an album,
I remember, we paying the money for what we did in the studio, and the next
time we'd come in he'd have some new equipment! (laughing on both sides here).
And I'd ask him "oh, you got this and this!" and he'd say, "yeah, that's
what you guys' money paid for!" And that continued for years and years, so that
studio sort of grew up alongside of us, you might say. We recorded all sorts of
albums, all the way up through the Circus Maximus was recorded there. And then
after that he sold the studio and we decided to build our own studio. That's
where we're at nowadays.
That was sort of a grow up step by step thing with our own studio; learning how
to do it ourselves, acquiring the money to be able to actually build the
studio, acquire the equipment and everything...
- Nowadays you can just plug into a computer and the quality can be
achieved at home; it's amazing how technology has not only leveled the playing
field but exploded it too. Now everybody and their mother can record at home.
Yeah, and then you have things like youtube out there which makes it really
easy to get your music out to the public nowadays compared to the old days. You
used to have all the labels siphoning through the bands they didn't like to get
you the bands that they thought were the best. And you don't really have that
happening as much nowadays, you can get on youtube and you can enter anything
and everything. From good to bad! So like you said, it's sorta evened the
playing field but at the same time it sorta made for a big clusterfuck too!
(laughs).
But we actually excelled up into the digital recording situation, we don't do
it on analog or anything, anymore... obviously...
- Do you find digital superior, because there's still people that
swear by the old analog sound. You hear this debate going on all the time.
Yeah, actually, the main thing that's different is analog has a very compressed
sound to it because the frequency range is not near as dynamic and broad as a
digital situation is. With digital you can reproduce sounds that only dogs can
hear (laughing here.) You know? And you couldn't do that on tape before. And
that's the big difference in audio quality I think, is that one's really
expansive and sort of limited. But, because of those compression limitations,
it can make drums sound a lot better, if you ask me. So I still believe analog
recording has it's place, and what they're getting into now - high dollar
studios - are getting to where they're taping a lot of stuff ON tape, but
they've got it in coalition with their ProTools or whatever they're using. And
they're moving the data over to computer, but it's being recorded on analog
tapeheads. So you get the best of both worlds, because it's an awful lot easier
to edit in digital form than it is in tape. Because it's not like the old days
where you actually have to cut and paste...
- And splice it in...
Now all you have to do is cut and paste. But I have to say we don't use
triggered drums, and we don't use fake technology in the sense of... you
know...
- No autotune... (laughing here)
No, I don't cut and paste, I absolutely DON'T do that. All the rhythm tracks
you hear are me playing the guitar track all the way straight through from the
beginning of the song to the end. Every once in awhile we'll do punch-ins for
guitar solos and stuff like that, of course, you know; but we were doing that
anyway with analog. It's not like we're changing anything. But it's definitely
a big thing to us that we keep it as natural as possible so it doesn't sound
like machines playing music; it's still people playing music.
I find that there's a lot of mods that you can get nowadays that help digital
sound more analog.
- With Adobe Audition, which is what I use, there's a vintage warmer
which GIVES you that analog sound.
Exactly. And there's tons of plug-ins that you can get for your DAW's nowadays,
it's huge out there. A lot of people swear by ProTools, but to tell you the
truth, there's 101 different DAW's out there, and they're ALL really good. Some
of them might not have as many good aspects as others but almost all of them do
exactly the same thing. ProTools definitely was the innovator.
- Oh yeah, a lot of people STILL use it.
Oh absolutely. The place we master at they've got a big ProTools system.
Cornerstone Studios, and he swears by ProTools and Mac's and all that stuff. I
don't, I tend to just...
- I'm a PC guy myself (laughing here).
I'm a PC guy too (laughing). And to tell you the truth, it's a lot easier to
work than a Mac is.
- Well, it's more compatible, I mean more people write software for
PC's than anything else. So, go with the format!
And right now I'm using studio one from Personnas, it's the DAW that we use in
our studios. But we've just gone to that recently, you haven't heard an album
yet done by us on that because we just upgraded our studio. We were doing it on
a Roland BS2480 system, and I've still got the system, I love it, but it's a
dinosaur now. I mean it doesn't even have USB technology in it. But it's still
a great unit, and for the time it was spectacular. But it was all made for each
other, and that's still the attitude I take with recording systems. If you get
stuff that's made for each other, you don't have problems with machines not
talking to each other.
- Synchronization issues...
Yeah, and for example, we take that to the n'ths degree, because our 24 track
mixer is a presonnus mixer, and we're using a presonnus DAW with it. And the
things just immediately, when we set it up (snaps fingers) it's like "Bing! Oh,
we like each other!" And we have no latency problems or anything because of
that. And we're not even using the fanciest of connection sources; we're using
I think it's called the S800 FireWire. It's top of the line FireWire but it's
not like some of the other things you have like Dante and stuff that's out
there that are supposedly really combatitive against latency.
- Now I'm sure you've seen just about every style of metal there was.
I know that your albums incorporated thrash. You ever see a time when maybe
you'll incorporate elements of black metal, or death metal?
Well, we've always sort of done the death metal thing... a little bit, because
the "Voyager" album was extremely light; there's several songs on it that are
practically death metal, a lot of "rrrrrr!" from me. Come to find out,
Scandinavia loves that album.
We've sort of approached it a little bit, there's a little bit of fusion of the
death metal thing in there. Not necessarily black metal. But we definitely
approach doom, thrash, progressive, psychedelic... Anything that we like, it's
what I go after. If it trips my trigger, I'm after it, and I'm looking to
combine it with what we do and try and make something unique out of it, because
that's what Manilla Road has ALWAYS been about and I hope it never changes.
We're ALWAYS striving to do something a little different than what we've done
in the past. So, I don't think you'll ever see another album of ours where we
try to make it like "Crystal Logic" or "Open The Gates."
Not that I don't LIKE AC/DC, I do, but I don't want to be a band that sounds
the same from album to album. I have all the reverence in the world for those
guys because they stuck to their guns, even though back in the day when people
were slamming them for sounding the same, every album. Now they've done it for
so long, and they've sold more albums than any other frickin' band in the
world. And so now you got all the media saying "oh, they're great" because they
stuck to their guns.
And that seems to be sort of happening with us too; people are really chiming in
to us that they're just so happy that we didn't give in and do something super
accessible or that we didn't just keep on trying to reproduce "Crystal Logic"
over and over. The majority of our fanbase likes what we're doing, but you
can't please everybody all the time. There's certain people that prefer the
Rick Fisher days, some others prefer the Randy Fox days. We found a lot of
young kids nowadays, they prefer what we're doing now over the old stuff. More
than anything, we just have to please ourselves.
- I see a lot of bands nowadays are thinking: "guitar, bass,
keyboards, drums vocals... What else is there left to do in metal?" To me, I
think a lot of innovation in metal is going to have to come from mixing styles;
like industrial black metal, symphonic death metal... Where do you think metal
will be in 20 years? 50 years even?
God, that's really hard to say; I mean, it depends on what kind of instruments
and technology they invent between now and then. Because obviously what has made
metal so easy for everybody to produce nowadays is the tech that we have; the
technology is just out there. Like our tech is more advanced than we are, you
know, in our brains. And heaven forbid we ever have that apocalyptic situation
happen, because none of us know how to build most of the stuff we've got! You
know? (laughing)
- You mean like if E.M.P.'s come in and wipe out our circuitry?
Yeah, we're screwed... But as long as we've got electricity I'm still good to
go. Because I've got ALL Marshals! (MUCH laughter from both)...
- (laughing) Tube technology!
Yeah, that's what I'm playing through tonight, as a matter of fact; it's a 50
Watt, English made tube amp that I've had modified a bunch of times. It's the
old stuff, built back in the 50's or 60's.
But, to answer your question, man that's a hard one. But I have a feeling that
people in music... The music industry has always looked to fusion to come up
with new styles, even in the pop markets.
- Well, metal is one of the most versatile genres of music EVER. I
mean nowhere else will you hear a style of music that will mix everything from
opera to classical to folk, to techno, industrial, gothic, punk and hardcore...
You got bands like Speedwolf who mix speed punk....
Yeah, they're fun, love those guys. We've played with them a couple of times
and always loved hanging out with them.
There's just all sorts of possibilities. And I think it's just a trait of the
music industry that the fusion we're talking about happens eventually. Look at
what country music used to be, really raw country music back in the day. But
nowadays, it sounds like country rock music, instead of country...
- Like Hank Jr? (laughing here) I'm not AS versed in country but I
know of that.
Not as much Hank Jr.... Well, I'm talking about even the big stars like Jason
Aldean; they're putting out stuff that actually has more of a country rock,
like a Lynyrd Skynyrd flavor to it or something like that. Instead of the
three chord Johnny Cash type stuff...
- Yeah, but look how long it took them to advance to that point. I
guess they have their core audience, but I guess maybe they just got
comfortable, whereas metal musicians just strive to always push the envelope
in their ideology, music and their lyrical content.
I think that's it. Well, you gotta remember, like for example at the Grand Ole
Opry... for soo long you couldn't even have a guitar amplifier at that Opry
House. It was verboten, it was something you couldn't do. The only thing that
was electrified at that Opry House was the P.A. and that was it. Everything
else had to be played on acoustic instruments basically. And so that was
staying raw country for as long as they could do it. But as the industry
changed, eventually they changed too, and now you've got the Eagles playing
there... And of course you're not gonna get the Eagles in there without some
electric guitars.
And that's another good example. The Eagles were like one of those bands that
helped innovate country sounds into popular rock songs. And there's a lot of
bands that helped that happen: Lynyrd Skynyrd, Blackfoot, Atlanta Rhythym
Section, ZZ Top... But yeah it did take a long time and a lot longer than it
did with hard rock or heavy metal bands. Of course, I grew up in an age where
heavy metal wasn't really a term for bands yet, or music. It sorta came about
WHILE I was getting into the music industry. But you did have bands, like Black
Sabbath who never really considered themselves doom metal, but they are called
doom metal now.
- Pentagram was around about as long too.
Strangely enough, I hadn't even ever heard of Pentagram until just a couple of
years ago. Well, maybe more than a couple of years ago.
- Was it the movie... The Bobby Liebling movie?
No, actually, we ended up playing with them at the Boricellus(sp?) festival in
Portugal. And the guys were going "Oh, god, we're playing with Pentagram, this
is so cool!" And I'm like: "Who?" It's a cool sounding name but I don't know
these guys. "You're kidding, Shark, you don't know who Pentagram is? Bobby
Liebling?" No, I don't. "Oh wow." And then the movie came out and they're like
"Oh, you GOTTA check this out."
- He's been around THAT long.
And just like anybody else now, all these ancient tapes are being resurrected
and put out there now. So. Yeah, that's a band I can't say "yeah, I followed
them." But Sabbath's a good example for me. They always just considered
themselves a heavy rock and roll band. But nowadays they're okay, Tony's okay
with being called the grandfather of doom metal. Hell I'd be cool with it too!
(laughs). And he deserves it, those guys are the ultimate. They were one of the
bands that got me started. The first big rock and roll concert I ever saw was
Black Sabbath on their "Paranoid" tour. I stood RIGHT in front of Tony Iommi
ALL night going "That's what I wanna do! I wanna do that, THAT is it. I'm going
home and that's what I'm gonna do" And sure enough, that's what I do now.
Well, maybe not as well as Tony does. He's the godfather to so many of us. But
yeah, the future I think it's wide open and I think you're going to find, like
you said, metal musicians always try to press the envelope. Well, we've already
got... I saw on youtube some band with banjos, a country band doing Metallica
songs...
- Yeah, I saw that (laughing here).
Great, okay. I guess now we got bluegrass metal! (much laughter here). And
obviously we've all chimed in on classical music a long time ago. Fusing that
with metal music, which I think works perfectly. The first true composer was
probably Wagner, when he did Gotter Dammerung...
- "Flight Of The Valkyries."
Yeah, the Ring Cycle and all that. And some of that is just exceedingly heavy!
- Oh, I know it. Just the atmosphere and epicness of it all.
Absolutely. And then if you want to go for Voivod sounding dischordal stuff,
listen to "Tocatta And Fugue In D Minor" by Johan Sebastian Bach...
- I like Voivod, it's kinda funny you mention that.
Oh, I love Voivod. I especially love the MIDDLE of their career. I didn't
really care for their first couple of albums that much, but once they did
"Killing Technology" I was TOTALLY on board!
- Absolutely. That was the first album I ever heard by them.
And it was the same way with Slayer, I was NOT a Slayer fan until they did
"Reign In Blood." And when they did "Reign In Blood" I was like "Oh shit! Okay,
they did it right this time, I love these guys."
- Well, they kinda painted themselves in a corner, because after
"Reign In Blood," it's like "How do you top that?" It's considered one of the
BEST thrash albums ever!"
And one of the shortest! (laughs) What is it 36 minutes, 38 minutes? But every
song's a killer. A definite K.I.A. on every song. And I do like a lot of their
other stuff they did after that, and their old stuff I like live.
NORTHERN CROWN.
Interview with Zachary via phone.
Another newcomer for this issue. I must say I was heavily impressed
with their debut release, and they have a newer album out entitled "The
Others." The thing I loved about their EP was how well their singer channeled
more than one Candlemass vocalist in the cover they did. Their next album is
even open to yet MORE experimentation, so no telling where this band will end
up. Interesting to hear their black metal roots, which may bear fruit in the
future... More on that later on.
- It looks like when you guys started out, you were kinda like a two
piece for that EP you guys did.
Let me give you the whole background. Leona, who's the bassist... Her and I
have been friends for a long time. And we actually used to have a black metal
band together. And that kinda fell apart so we started Northern Crown. So she
was actually a founding member of Northern Crown with me. And she's actually
the one that came up with the name for the band. Now before that first album
came out, she left the band; we sorta had a falling out over her leaving the
band. Two years later we patched things up; she joined just in time to record
the second album. So at that point it was just me and I was trying to get a
record finished; I didn't have any members in the band.
A co worker of mine, Stephanie, introduced me to her then-boyfriend who is now
her husband. That's Frank (their vocalist - Ed). He had moved to Fort
Lauderdale; he was still living in Nashville. And the intial introduction was
that "hey, Frank can find you a drummer to play on the record." Because I was
going to do everything else; I was actually originally the singer in the band
too. So he then introduced me to Josh who had drummed on both records so far.
And I kinda mentioned "Listen, I'm not really feeling singing this; I actually
wanna get a real heavy metal singer." And Frank casually mentioned that he
wanted to do it, and I'm like "Well, dude, lemme Just hear you sing." What I
was doing, was basically I was having people send me a demo of them doing like
the first verse and chorus of 'Heaven And Hell' (Black Sabbath with Dio - Ed).
Because if you can sing that, you can sing all the Northern Crown stuff! (I'm
laughing here - Ed.)
And then he got really insecure about it, and I'm like "dude, come on." So I
ended up giving like 3 auditions, and Frank was one of them, and he ended up
being the favorite and I'm like, "No, seriously, you're the guy to sing on
this." So that's how we ended up doing the first record; I basically had the
entire thing tracked, and then I sent the sessions up to Nashville. They laid
down the drums, and Frank did his vocals, then he did a couple of solos on the
album. We mixed it and released it, and much to my surprise, it was very well
received. Not that I was surprised because I didn't think the songs were good,
but I'm surprised because we're nobody, we're not playing live (laughing here
again - Ed). No label support, I funded this completely out of my pocket. And
that includes, on that first album, I paid the other band members. So I paid
Josh and Frank to play, and a couple other local musicians played on the
album too; I tried to pay them, they didn't want money. Cool, whatever. So,
that was album number one. Again, pretty well received.
- It's kinda interesting, just looking at the first EP... I guess
you'd kinda call it an EP, although to be honest with you, the average length
of a doom metal album is about an hour long with 5 tracks! Some people might
consider the first release an EP, but it's like "eh, it's about doom metal
length, really." (laughing here.
Yeah. I consider the first one an EP, and the second one a full length. To
me, a full length is when you hit like 40 minutes.
- The "Reign In Blood" of doom metal, I guess... (laughing again here).
Yeah, it's one of those things where at a certain point, you're just sort of
nitpicking. So that's the first album, and then I started writing the second
one; it took us a little while to get started on it because Frank was moving
to Florida; he was getting married and starting a new job. Unfortunately, real
life and heavy metal are not super compatible. But we got it done, released it
in October, and again got a really good reception; we actually got some
coverage from some bigger media outlets; we ended up being in Decibel, we got a
big two third page article about us in PowerPlay magazine, which is one of the
bigger rock and metal magazines in the U.K. Angry Metal Guy gave us a STELLAR
review, we actually got a lot of new fans of the band. That's through albums
number one and two.
- Where I was at, I obviously expected a lot more from the second
full length. I kinda feel like the EP was... At first I was kinda like "aw,
5 songs, why did they put a cover song on there?" But his vocals, he
definitely has that Johan Lanqvist delivery for that song DOWN to a T. And
there's also not quite the operatic style, but there's hints of Rob Lowe and
a little bit of Messiah in there. So I think that was a perfect cover to do;
it showcases his vocals VERY well; I was blown away by that cover. Everybody
and their mother knows about Candlemass, but that was a PERFECT track to
showcase his vocal talents. I thought...
So, here I'll give you a couple of inside stories there. Originally, the cover
on that album was going to be 'Electric Funeral.' I started working on it, and
I wasn't feeling it. Black Sabbath is my favorite band ever. The reason I
wasn't feeling it, is because, man, if you're gonna do something like Black
Sabbath, especially Sabbath with Bill Ward, you have to jam that out live. And
it just didn't have any feel me doing it by myself and sending the tracks off
to the guys in Nashville. And I'm trying to figure out what to do, because you
take that cover off and all of a sudden, the album's really, REALLY short,
which we didn't want to do. And I'm talking to Stephanie, who is Frank's wife,
and she's like "well, dude, you should cover something from Candlemass." And
that's what led us to doing 'Crystal Ball.' Which is just an amazing song.
- Oh, that whole album is amazing. That was the first Candlemass
album I ever heard. And then "Nightfall" came along. That was good too, but
you know, I just kinda preferred the old Johan Lanqvist vocals. Not that
Messiah wasn't good, and I enjoyed Rob Lowe, but Rob just couldn't seem to
pull off the classic stuff live. And that was a shame.
Yeah, I remember seeing that. So in 2008 I saw Candlemass in Chicago.
- Ah, lucky you! (laughing here).
It was a great show. Obviously Rob was in the band. He has crazy pipes, but he
can't remember the lyrics. And he has himself admitted he can't remember the
lyrics. I actually read an interview with him where he out and out said "Yeah,
I'm kinda lazy." And I'm like "Dude!" I guess if you're owning the fact that
you're not putting the work in. But man, you're Candlemass!
- Yeah, YOU'RE Candlemass now.
So, you know, you're not in Solitude Aeturnus anymore, you're in Candlemass.
THE sort of best band of that genre. You put the work in because there's
expectations that come along with that.
- Well, there's a respect level given. When I was in Victim Nine, he
(Jerry Tharp - Ed) wrote some of the most complicated songs I'd ever tried to
sing, but I was at work for like two weeks plugging that little three songs
that I was going to do live. You know, you have to put the work in, how can you
not? That would be my dream job, I'd be up for 40 hours a week just working on
the songs and getting them down. That's just me. I don't understand the
mindset. See, that's what always gets me, it's always these musicians that have
been jaded, and I'm still looking for my first real band that I can be in and
just carry it on. I did the three songs with the Darkflight record, but that's
about as far as I got with that; I'm STILL looking for a band right now!
Frank and I are both working professionals. We both work in technology; I'm
self employed. He's married; we're both homeowners. We're busy guys and we have
lives. But that being said, we're incredibly dedicated to our music. I have a
recording studio at home, Frank has a studio at home. He just released a solo
album earlier this year, that's kinda 80's prog rock. So think like
Queensryche. It's an amazing album; it's like a 3 song EP. So we're dedicated
to this. And at the end of the day; and I love that people have latched on to
us. There's no casual fans of Northern Crown. If you like us, you're into us.
Or you may not know about us yet. But I have to go to bed at night and know
that I did the best I could in every regard on these albums. There's errors
that I pick out on BOTH albums. I HEAR them when I listen to them, maybe I
made a mistake in the mix, one of us was off in the instruments. And it drives
me NUTS. It's probably stuff that nobody else hears. But the fact is that we're
making this music for ourselves. And that doesn't excuse it not being perfect.
Pride dictates, for me, that it has to be perfect. It won't be perfect but we
at least have to STRIVE for it.
- That's the issue I ran into with Ivo, he's an extreme
perfectionist. A couple of those songs we worked on together, we went back and
forth for like 3 weeks on one song. One song I couldn't figure out what he was
looking for vocal wise, he was just like "maybe you just ought to take a break
for a couple of weeks and kinda put it to rest!" (laughing here). I was going
through some other stuff too.
But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter how perfect the album is to YOU,
you got somebody sitting at the other end of the line that's gonna pick it
apart minute by minute, second by second, track by track. It's kind of the
unaviodable thing. Sometimes you can overwork a song to death, I've been in
that situation too.
Yeah, you DEFINITELY can, there's gotta be a certain point where you just sorta
draw a line in the sand. And you're like "it's done, it's time to move on with
this." That's been a hard lesson for me to learn; I'm DEFINITELY better at it
than I was three years, four years ago. And that just comes with experience and
age I think.
That's actually a really great piece of advice I got. It was like an article I
read somewhere is basically don't overdemo. And I would demo a song like from
scratch multiple times. I don't do that anymore; I kinda get it to a good place
and then "okay, it's done."
- And I guess that's important too. It was kinda amazing when Ivo sent
me that first song I worked on. Of course, he's a guy that has made amazing music
for 5 or 6 releases anyway, and I've always been into what he's done. But
sometimes it's like, if it's meant to be... And you'll just feel it; you'll know
it right away. The first song we worked on, we had it done in less than a week.
Keep in mind, he's in Bulgaria, I'm in Atlanta, and we're emailing files back
and forth. That was one of those, I felt it, I knew what needed to be written
lyric wise, I knew what needed to be sung, I knocked it out and it was a done
deal.
Over the course of re-arranging everything, one of the lyrics got kind of out
of place, because he would make me do three or four takes of a song. But one
re-arranging actually made the lyrics make more sense, so sometimes there's
forces that kinda guide things in the proper direction, and you just kinda have
to let that happen instead of trying to over analyze it and over complicate
things.
You know, what I can say is that for the first two albums, I had an idea in my
head on what I wanted those records to be, and that's not what they ended up
being. And that's not in a bad way it's just that... I can't predict, and
honestly I can't even really control where the records are going to go. So I
just sort of write the songs, and just let it be. We're pretty far along into
making the next album; it'll be out sometime next year. I can't really say for
certain. For example, the hurricane... We haven't worked on it since Irma hit.
Actually, since before Irma hit. Yeah, it was the end of August was the last
time we worked on the album. So that's kinda knocked us off schedule a little
bit.
- Everybody okay down there? I know there's a lot of devastation. It
came up through Georgia, I'm dealing with hurricane force winds as far north as
metro Atlanta, which is unheard of.
So lemme tell you about that. So I'm in Fort Lauderdale. We didn't get it that
bad. We lost power. I was going to be in Indianna the weekend that Irma hit. I
actually ended up driving up there; I was going up there for a family event.
And I came back the day after the storm hit, so I drove through Georgia the
following days after the storm. So Monday night, the day after the storm, I
stayed in Atlanta overnight then headed back to Florida. Got about 30 miles
south of Georgia; there's no power, there's nothing. And that's how North and
Central Florida were too. I don't want to go so far as to say a wasteland
because the buildings were all standing. But I tell ya, you're driving down the
Florida turnpike in Central Florida, and that's out in the middle of nowhere.
And it's BLACK. Honestly dude, it was creepy as hell. I have NO urge to make
that drive again.
- I tell ya, it's kind of a funny thing, the difference between
Savannah residents and Florida residents... Whenever Florida hears "there's a
hurricane 120 miles out in the ocean, it MIGHT head this way," everybody
evacuates a week, three days before. Savannah, it's like "the hurricane's off
the coast of Tybee Island," "eh, it's probably not going to do anything, it'll
probably veer off." "The eye of the hurricane is ON Tybee Island..." "Ah, it's
okay, we'll stick it out" (laughing here).
I used to live in Savannah, and there's been SO many years when the forecaster
said "yeah, the hurricane is gonna drop right over Tybee Island," which is 10
miles from Savannah. And it gets up the Atlantic and for some reason that Gulf
stream air and that warm water pushes it out to sea. So we've sat through MANY
hurricanes that just never hit our shores.
So you know what's kinda interesting about that. I was living down here when
Wilma and Katrina hit. And people were very blase' about it, they were just
like "whatever." The reaction out of people for Irma was a little different
than I had seen, which was 12 years ago. People seemed a little more
anxious about it. But then again, you know what dude, it was one of the 5 most
powerful hurricanes ever. It was a little more terrifying.
- Getting 50 and 60 mile an hour winds as far north as we are; I'm
right up in Suwanee which is 35 miles NORTH of Atlanta. And we're literally
like; I'm 300 something miles from my hometown of Savannah which is right on
the Atlantic Ocean. So to get hurricane... Not hurricane force winds but
tropical storm winds that far north, you know this was a hell of a storm. No
doubt!
So when I was driving that Monday night, and I was on I-24 between Chatanooga
and Nashville, so you're kinda up in the mountains a little bit there. That's
when Irma, which was a tropical storm at the time was coming through. So can
you imagine racing down the side of one of those mountains with 50 mile an hour
winds whipping around! (laughing a bit here).
- Yeah, you wonder how high up those winds can go, because I've
camped out at Mt. Pisgah in North Carolina. And you know, you think "are we
high enough to where we're safe from those winds and what not?" Because when
you get to the top of Mt. Pisgah, you're kinda like up above the clouds. It's
kind of surreal. If you were to throw planks out at the top of the mountain
range you're like, you could look down and see clouds. It's kinda cool.
I'm not sure how high a hurricane actually is up in the air. What was I gonna
say, oh, so I started talking about the next album a little bit. Um, like I
kinda had some ideas of what I thought I was gonna write and that ended up NOT
being the case. To give you a little bit of teaser and preview... There's a
song on there that's like a really epic, proggy song, there's a total stoner/
doom song on there... There's a total 70's rock, Uriah Heep sort of thing going
on in another song. We're just really... I find myself tapping more and more
into my love of 70's rock and 70's metal, like Sabbath, Deep Purple and Uriah
Heep and that stuff...
- You gotta mention Pentagram in there too. (laughing here).
Yep. Yeah. So... Um, total tangent, just reminded me; I was at a local wrestling
show like two months ago. And somebody came out to 'Forever My Queen.' And I'm
like "Wow." Somebody coming out to Pentagram.
- Wow. That guy's been around forever. It's kinda funny; the EP was
very well received of course. Personally, I thought... And I know you guys have
a lot of years of history in the band before the EP. I kinda thought it was too
soon... There's a LOT of experimentation on "The Others." There's a few times
when it kinda looses me because you kinda... You know, you're used to that
straightforward... And you guys definitely have some heavy guitar work on
there. Don't get me wrong, I like "The Others..." It definitely took awhile to
grow on me. Because there was just so much new stuff and new influences and
ideas coming at me all at once. It DEFINITELY took me a lot longer to get into
"The Others" than the EP.
Yeah, so I knew that creatively I was taking some risks on that album. And you
know, for example, 'No One Came To Mourn Me.'...
- (laughing) Kinda figured we'd get to that song!
So anybody that... Any of my friends that aren't into metal that's their
favorite song from that album. Anybody like my age that's in their 40's or so
and grew up in the 80's listening to Depeche Mode, and like that new wavey,
electronic music from the 80's... That's their favorite song. You start reading
the reviews of it and people don't know what to make of it. Unfortunately,
sometimes metalheads show their asses a little bit. Because somebody called it
like synth pop at some point (I'm laughing here). And i'm like, "Dude. There's
NO POP on this record."
- Right, exactly. It's not Apoptygma Berzerk when they went away from
their hardline industrial stuff and started doing 'Cathy's Song.' I'm very well
versed in electronica. In fact, people don't realize this: The FIRST issue of
Vibrations Of Doom Magazine that ever came out in 1992 I was interviewing and
reviewing bands like KMFDM, Front 242, Apoptygma Berzerk, The Mission UK, Red
Lorry Yellow Lorry... So I was into goth, industrial and electronic music way
before the first issue of my own music magazine came out.
And that's kinda what I've wanted to do all along, it's just that I don't get
a whole lot of support from electronic and industrial music. Because it's just
not really... It's almost a dead genre to be honest with you, which is really
kinda sad. Because I like stuff like Malhavoc and Ministry. Front Line Assembly
especially, I thought was just one of the first industrial bands to start mixing
the guitars in there besides Malhavoc and Ministry. And that stuff was just
ungodly to me... So I get where you're coming from with 'No One Came To Mourn
Me...'
So lemme explain some of the origins of that song to you. So I had actually
written the lyrics to that song first. And there's not necessarily a formula to
what I do, because sometimes the lyrics will come first, sometimes the MUSIC
will come first, sometimes they happen in parallel. But I had all the lyrics to
that written. And I'm sitting there one night in front of the computer by
myself figuring out what I'm going to do with it because I REALLY liked what I
had written. And I'm like... trying to figure out the music and I'm like "I
don't think this is a guitar song!" Because I really don't! You get basically
into the middle of 'Mourn...' and there's like a big crescendo like where all
the strings and the synthesizers are all in. That was the seed of that song;
that little 30 second stretch I had written.
And I played it for Frank, I'm over at his house one day. And I pulled out my
phone and played it. And he didn't really get it. He didn't get where I was
going with it and I was like "Alright, hold on." A couple of weeks later I had
figured out how to blow it up and do a full song, and I'm like "these are the
words to go with it." And he starts tracking it, and it's like... I don't know
how people are going to react to this... (thinking here, slight pause).
They in fact react to it very poorly. But I LOVE what we did there.
- I think it's a great song. I really do. But you know, I'm versed in
that kind of music. To me it's strange for a band that's kinda got that
established sound for their first ever full length, but you know... Some people
just mature faster than others, so (laughing here).
Keep in mind, I'm 40 years old. So this is the... people have known of me since
2014 when the first album came out. And normally a musician might be a little
more seasoned at the age of, so I was 37 when that album came out. Dude, I've
been writing songs for a decade and a half or longer by that point. It was just
stuff that nobody had ever heard.
You know what, on top of that too I would just say that Frank and I are VERY
progressive minded that there's... Not a lot of rules in this band, other than
to say it needs to sound like Northern Crown. And that's honestly it. So if we
write an electronic song and we're like "yeah, dude, this sounds like us." Or
if we write sort of a classic rock song. The track that I think is gonna be the
title track on the next album. To me it sounds like Uriah Heep. When I play it
for my dad, and he says "Dude, it sounds like Uriah Heep." (laughing here -
Ed). Well, yeah. I played it for someone else and they said it sounded like
Trouble.
- (laughing) Oh, wow. that's a hell of a compliment!
Yeah. It's unmistakably us. It's unmistakably Frank and I. It's just an
evolution of what we've been doing. And on top of that, the thing to keep in
mind too about us... The first album, everything was written and I handed it
off to Frank. The second album, I still wrote a lot of it but he was a little
more involved creatively. NOW we're doing everything side by side.
What's happened with this album is I'll come up with a couple of riffs. I'll go
over to his house, we'll jam them out; we'll have like a little jam session as
a demo. I'll take what we did in that jam session and then sort of make a nice
version of it in Pro Tools. Then I'll go back the next week and then we'll
start working on the vocal arrangement. And we've actually been writing the
lyrics for this new album on the fly. Like we'd literally sit in a room
together, close the door... And I'll tell him "this is what I think the song is
about; this is kinda where I want to go with it." And we'll sit there and write
a verse, record it, write a verse, record it, write the chorus, record it. It's
then a really positive thing for us at this point. It's been a REALLY good
thing for us as a bandf to do that.
And listen... I am most assuredly in a lot of ways a control freak. (Much
laughter here - Ed). I am better about that as I get older... You know, Frank
as a singer should be able to pick the words he wants to sing...
- Yeah, that's what I would think too. That was one nice thing about
with Darkflight, I got to write the lyrics for my own parts. I write kinda
differently... When the song 'Giving Up' was presented to me, and I realized
what the subject matter was... This was subject matter that I've been living
for 46 years! (laughing). So I just basically sat down and wrote out a bunch of
lyrical ideas. Stuff just POURED out of me, I had enough lyrics to cover
literally three songs! It was just something natural; you feel it and you're
just like bam! it's there.
To me, it's gotta be a little bit more difficult when it's two people trying to
write lyrics as opposed to just one. And a lot of people think the singer
usually writes all his own lyrics, but that's not always the case in some
bands.
It could be difficult. There's actually a part on the second album, 'Les
Autres.' There's one part of the song before it goes into like a little
mellow break, the line is 'I want to die.' And that line was supposed to be "I
want to fucking die." And we got into an argument about that. And he's like
"dude, I don't think using the word is necessary," and "I don't want my family
hearing me say 'fuck' on a record." And it turned into an argument. And I'm
like, "Dude, don't you get the gravity of what I'm trying to say here?"
- It's an extreme form of saying what you're saying...
And then he started to just give in, and I'm like "No, no no no. You're not
gonna just give in because that's what I want. You're gonna stand in front of
the microphone and you're gonna figure out something that works. And if you
find something that works that I'm happy with, then we're gonna do it. But I
need you to understand BEFORE WE DO THAT, how IMPORTANT this is to me. (slight
pause to let the words sink in - Ed).
And so yeah, we got into an argument about it, but you know what? It worked. We
came to a resolution. Where I'm going with that, is we're creatively in synch
at this point. There's definitely debates as we're sitting here working on
stuff, because I express myself verbally, lyrically, way different than he
does. And there can be some battles here because I'm like... I feel like the
words that you use are really important to the sound of the band. But again,
everything that we're doing up to this point... I feel like is working.
Obviously, we'll see how everyone thinks once the album is out next year.
- Do all the members of Northern Crown all live in Florida now?
No. Frank and I are the only ones that live here. Leona did live here but she
relocated to Seattle back in 2015. And then Josh is still in Nashville. And I
don't say this to slight anyone else in the band, but Frank and I do the bulk
of the work. And you know that that's how bands are. I don't involve Josh until
everything's done. Josh is the drummer. I generally won't involve Leona until
I've programmed drums and got all the riffs figured out. I'll get some feedback
from her on the way. I'm sort of the first layer, I start bringing Frank into
it. We kinda get a song figured out that everybody else starts to hear at that
point. At least that's how it's going, especially for this album that's how
it's going.
- I mentioned to somebody the other day. Maybe I'm the only one who
sees this, but... To me it's kinda ironic. It's kinda cool and kinda funny
but kinda ironic that a band from the southernmost state in the United States
is named Northern Crown. (laughing here).
Well, it's named after a constellation. I definitely have heard that several
times. Definitely heard that several times (laughing). At one point somebody
thought it was a Game Of Thrones reference (laughing on both sides). Which was
funny because at that point I had never watched Game Of Thrones.
- Aw, man, you don't know what you're missing!
No, I have now... But at that point I hadn't watched ANY of it. I didn't watch
the first season until the second season was already underway.
- Now you're hooked line and sinker... right?(laughing).
I don't do a good job of staying up with shows or anything. My friends will get
frustrated with me. When the Star Wars movie came out a couple of years ago, I
didn't see it until 3 months after it came out. Not that I don't care, but I'm
sorta off somewhere doing something else.
- Yeah, well, musicians are usually busy with stuff. I know the first
time I heard Northern Crown, the first thing I thought was it kinda sounds like
the band name for a New York City hardcore band. Like Northside Kings or
something like that. That was my first initial reaction to the bandname. And
then I found out you guys were playing doom metal and I was like "Oh yeah, I
gotta get in on this," and THEN I found out you guys were from Florida and I
was like "okay, that's kinda cool." (laughing).
Is there anything else you wanted to know, any other questions for me? I've
just kinda been rambling, so I didn't know if you had specific questions and
I've just been talking over you this whole time.
- No, no, it's fine. I like to structure interviews so that they
kinda look like... People that read the interviews are just kinda dropping in
on a conversation between two metalheads. I don't like the atypical,
stereotypical bullshit questions... like "Oh, what's your favorite band," or
(said in a dopey voice) "What are you guys writing about?"
You guys are real people, just like anyone else, and I kinda like to tap into
that. I always like to bring different and diverse questions to the table or
just topics of conversation. This is perfect.
The funny thing is, if somebody were to kinda ask me what we're writing about,
my response would be, "well, have you listened to the record, because it's
kinda obvious!" (laughter on both sides here - Ed). If anybody asks me what my
favorite bands are, my response would again be "have you listened to the
record?"
- Exactly... A lot of that's just kinda... "Do you guys like
Candlemass?" (laughing again here)
Okay, let me run down the big influences for you, because there's probably
maybe one or two surprises in there. Obviously, it's Black Sabbath, Candlemass,
and Deep Purple. Which are the really obvious ones.
- Yeah. Especially with the keyboards.
Opeth is a big one that I don't think it comes through but, like, the way that
I write, the way that I arrange things. There's definitely like a huge Opeth
influence there. And then, Steven Wilson from Porcupine Tree, who produced a
few Opeth albums... We're really big fans of his, and that definitely sorta
influences us. There's a King Crimson influence in there too and in fact the
way that I tune my guitar is the tuning that Robert Tripp uses. Because I
generally do not play in standard tuning. I actually play in a tuning called
New Standard. You can look it up on Wikipedia. There's definitely this prog
influence on us. That's the stuff that really, REALLY influences me.
Dude, I'm a BIG Motley Crue fan. Whenever I can find a moment to sneak a little
bit of sleaze in there, I'll do that. There's a little Uncle Acid hidden in the
next album. You definitely gotta search for it, you probably still won't find it
anyways, it's definitely a needle in a haystack. So that's the stuff that...
Basically once Candlemass started bringing... And I've been a Candlemass fan
for years and years and years. When Candlemass brought in the organs, that
completely changed the way that I looked at doom metal. And I'm like, wait a
second. This is... This is a great sound, in fact Opeth had been doing it...
Opeth and Candlemass had the same keyboard player...
- Why didn't I know that? (laughing here).
Yeah, it was the same guy that ended up playing keys for both of them when they
were doing the whole organ thing. And you know the Opeth song 'The Baying Of
The Hounds?' Again, that's just so perfect of like a heavy, HEAVY guitar riff
and then a heavy organ riff playing along. It's not just keyboard, it's organ.
It's different, you know?
- Like a Hammond organ maybe? Because I LOVE the Hammond. There's a
couple of bands that I really dig, like Hacienda from Germany. They're
electronica but they LOVE that Hammond organ. Sometimes it sounds silly, but
it's got a different sound; you know a Hammond when you hear it over anything
else.
Yeah, it's its own sound. The thing about a Hammond is that, especially when
you start distorting it, which is what the 70's rock bands did. It starts
sounding like a guitar. And that's one of the reasons it works so well in doom
metal and it doesn't sound out of place, because it sounds like a guitar,
except it sounds like a guitar with a lot of octaves. So it just kinda fits in
the mix really well. Where I don't think I could necessarily do a Jethro Tull
thing and throw a flute on top of it, because I think that would really stand
out.
- Well, Cathedral already did that anyway with their "Forest Of
Equilibrium" album. (laughing here).
Well, there you go. I'm going to limit my ripping off to just ripping off
Candlemass; I don't wanna rip off two doom legends.
- You know, you talk about diverse influences. I still have yet to
really see a doom band incorporate space rock, like Hawkwind or certain
passages of Pink Floyd's "Dark Side Of The Moon." I followed Hawkwind for many,
many years; in fact the second issue of my music magazine we interviewed Nik
Turner and we're getting ready to do so again (it hasn't happened yet). But
that's something that I've always wanted to hear. Anybody that's ever listened
to Hawkwind knows it; there's a lot of outer space, keyboard loops songs and
themes and sound effects. And Hawkwind, geez, they use lots of instruments.
What's really funny is that... There's a review that somebody did for "The
Others" where they were comparing us to Hawkwind. And dude, we don't sound like
Hawkwind. We don't. But what's funny about it is, I can tell the reviewers that
DON'T read the press release. Because the press release is there to set the
ground work for everything. And again, we spell out REALLY clearly what our
influences are, what we're trying to do, how we consider ourselves.
I was annoyed at the time, I'm laughing now.
- You know, a lot of times when I get press releases; to be honest
with you I just chuck them right out the window. Because a lot of times the
label will say "Sounds like..." or "Is Influenced by" or "if you like certain
bands, you'll like this..." Like for instance, a doom metal band, somebody will
say "If you like Electric Wizard, Hawkwind and Sleep," and nine times out of
ten I MIGHT hear hints of ONE of those bands in there.
Press releases have one purpose and one purpose only; it's to get you
interested enough to take the time... Which is sad really, if this is what you
do (run a music magazine - Ed. Wasn't very clear on this in the interview), you
shouldn't need a press release to help you. But they're trying to get you
excited enough, and going "this is different," or "this is something that might
stand out from the 450,000 other releases that come across my desk every day."
They're all trying to achieve the same goal, but a lot of them aren't 100%
honest in their descriptions and portrayals. And this is coming from somebody
who's been doing this shit for 25 years (26 now at this moment).
We write the press release ourselves. Frank's got a little more music biz
experience in that way than I do, so it'll end up being him that writes it, and
he's responsible for the final version of it. And then we have a PR team we
work with, Clawhammer. But as far as the bio and the press release, we write
all that stuff ourselves. There's no label fuckery in there (laughing).
- I'm definitely excited for the next record. Why in the HELL don't
you have a label going "hey, we need to sign you guys!" That's been my biggest
question. With the EP I figured by the time the album came out you would have
already HAD label support. And it's kinda surprising to me that you haven't.
So I have reached out to labels and there's been some interest, but basically
the interest has been for distro deals...
- (Sounding disappointed here, and Zachary senses that). Oh, okay.
Which is, by the way is fine too, but it still requires me to come out of
pocket. And I don't want to give up anything; I don't want to be beholden to
anybody. The reason that I would want a label is to get our music in stores in
Europe, because then that's gonna create a demand. Because you put a very
professional product together, you put the CD's in stores in Europe. Fans are
going to buy them, and then fans are gonna want to see us live and some
promoter is going to want to bring us to Europe to play.
Which would be fun to do; I'm not betting on it, I'm not depending on it, I'm
not expecting it. If the opportunities present themselves, you know, we'll
definitely try to do it. The reason we're not signed is we don't play live.
- Which that would have been my next, I guess my next question number
four hundred and eighty two. If you guys were ever planning on playing live and
getting out there.
We will figure out when to do it when the time is right. And that's with
understanding that the time may NEVER be right. As you know, being in a band is
difficult. I'm self employed; I do work as a consultant. I'm a software
engineer. Priority number one for me is to have money coming in. Because I'm
not on salary; I have to go out and hustle for every dollar. And that's not to
denigrate anybody that makes a living any other way; it's just what I kinda
chose to do for myself. That's A number one
My best friend and chief collaborator has a wife and a career, and those are
the important things for him. In the spare time that we have, we work on
Northern Crown. So you basically say out of however many free hours we have in
a year, X of those hours are gonna be spent on Northern Crown. So I could spend
the time writing new music, working on it with Frank, and then getting those
songs REALLY polished and just making a really bad ass, cohesive album that I'm
super proud of. OR, I could spend my time finding band members, finding
rehearsal space, making sure everybody shows up to practice, making sure
everybody at practice is staying focused and isn't just there to fuck off and
drink beer.
There's literally only so many hours that I can put into this band, and I would
rather that those hours go towards making new music. If the opportunity
presents itself for us to play live, and I'm fully into it and Frank's fully
into it... and then whomever the other musicians are, because it may not be
Josh or Leona because of geographic reasons. We find other musicians that fit
in personality wise, and sort of understand that they're coming in as musicians
in an existing band. And I'm not looking for, and this is going to make me
sound arrogant, but I'm not looking for creative guidance from anybody. It's
like, "dude, I need a lead guitarist, I need a keyboard player," that's what I
need and it's not necessarily that I need somebody to help me write songs or
send somebody to change the sound of the band. I have A job for you to do. And
that's another thing for me to manage to.
So, yeah, it's about getting the most out of the time that I have to put into
Northern Crown. But again, I don't wanna dampen anybody's hopes. I would LOVE
for us to be able to take these songs out on the road at some point but I can't
promise that that's going to happen.
- Well, when I think about all the bands that I've interviewed and
talked to and listened to and hung out with. Let's just for example say that
there's 4 or 5 people in a band. The fact that you can get 4 or 5 completely
different individuals to all come together at the same time when it's needed,
it's like... You know, I used to say "shit, man, it's been three years since
your last album, dude," but you think about it and you're like, it's a miracle
that they may have been able to get everybody on the same page for a certain
length of time to GET something accomplished.
Especially with the way life is nowadays. I don't listen to albums the way I
used to. I used to know all the lyrics by heart, every single song. Life
nowadays is NOT like it was when I was in my late teens and early 20's. Like
you said, there's responsibilities and you know... That's why issues don't come
out but once or twice a year because I don't feel right reviewing an album that
I haven't listened to nine or ten times.
It's good to have standards. That's what I talk about wanting the albums to
have a certain level of quality. It's the same thing that, would I love to
release an album this year, sure. But then I would be rushed. And I don't want
to do that.
RITUAL.
Interview with Gypsy ReBeth via facebook chat.
Ritual. Many people unfortunately STILL think the band is called Widow,
a fact that we're going to have to correct in the classic albums section.
Personally, I cannot for the life of me see WHY this band isn't revered along
side of Diamond Head, since their very first album "Widow," coming out right at
the beginning of the 1980's, is such an amazing album with wonderful vocals and
a very unique kind of melancholic atmosphere that you hear on the record; not
just the songs themselves and the vocals/guitar arrangements, but down to the
very unique and interesting production. I've always held a special place for
that particular album, nothing they've done since has come close to how epic
that album is. And of course there's some very interesting stories about Gypsy
ReBeth's life that shaped how this record turned out.
- I noticed that you seem to be the only original member left from
the earliest of days...
Uh, no, that's not true at all! Mason is still with me, the bass player. It's
kind of wierd actually because in Ritual he was the bass player from the
beginning. But what a lot of people don't know is he's actually a drummer as
well. And he did do a couple of things on a few tracks; he's pretty good. It's
been quite useful in the studio and of course there's always that option. He's
still with me, even on the acoustic stuff I go out and do now. But on that he
plays the kit, he doesn't play bass. The actual three original members of
Ritual are still alive and kicking. Rex, who was the original drummer ON
"Widow,' he's... I dunno where he is now but he's still alive and kicking in
Norfolk, which is where he came from.
- That's an amazing album. It's one of my favorites. A lot of people
talked about the production; to me, a rather minimal and stripped down
production; there's definitely an aura, an essence to each individual element.
It has a very different feel from most albums of that day. That's the best way
I can describe it really.
Yeah, I think Ritual always was a bit different. That was recorded at
Wickham's, on literally a 16 track analog desk. We've always used analog, I
won't use digital stuff; I just can't relate to it. In those days we were
tuned to like a drop D, nothing really special. But what it was, the actual
recording machine was running at um... cause they normally run at like 30
I.P.S. or something, so I think we ran it at 15. And that was the engineer's
idea not mine. It's just the way it always sounded; I don't know why. The
three of us just had that kind of sound and that's it.
- It's a wonderful record. I don't understand why you guys weren't as
revered as, say, Diamond Head, because that album is absolutely... I love that
fucking album, that album is absolutely amazing; I can't think of a bad track
on it!
Oh, thanks very much, I'm really flattered you'd say that. It's a really sad
story of Ritual, it's the usual tale of, uh, bad management, one disaster after
another. But the biggest tragedy was when the record company released the
album, they didn't put the band's name on the album! (laughs). It was just
released as Widow, and everybody thought the band's name was Widow, which was
complete and utter rubbish! But in those days, once you've pressed up a few
copies... And I think originally they pressed five or six thousand. But it was
enough of an investment not to change it.
In those days we were lucky, we had a PR guy called Max Clifford, who's fallen
from grace now, but he got us on the Freeman's Rock Show, the Friday Night Rock
Show, and that really kicked off the album. The management, when it all kind of
broke up because of heavy debts and bad management and stuff like that, the
remaining quota of the albums that were out there... we don't know... the
management seemed to sort of disappear and we never saw any more albums again.
Even now it's a bit of a mystery where they all are! They never come on the
market! I mean, one sold on ebay for like a grand! I dunno, $1500 dollars. I
have my own copy, but they're really rare now.
The reissue by Shadow Kingdom was really good because that gave us a chance for
a lot more people to hear it! They gave it a really nice treatment; new artwork
and all that. It was good that it sort of got out there again and didn't
disappear. I'm glad you like it!
- Oh yeah I love it! It's kind of weird because that album came out in 1983,
which kinda was at the tail end, or close to the end, of the whole New Wave Of
British Heavy Metal Movement, which started about 78... I guess the timing of
it, maybe if you guys had recorded it about 3 or 4 years earlier, you know?
One of the main problems for early British rock bands... And don't forget
Ritual was formed in 1973. We were going for years and years. But, you can ask
any sort of older British rock musician what radio was like and you just could
NOT get your stuff played on air. It was out there because we'd already done
things like mini albums on cassettes and stuff, which all the bands were doing
then. So we've been around and through it, but it took us THAT long to get air
play, it was that bad. Because the big companies were just corrupt. You know
how it is, and that's just how it was.
- It's funny you mention that, because the problems with the
recording industry have plagued bands for almost decades. And now, the record
labels realize that the music business is almost destroyed because of their
greed. It used to be back in the day, artists like the Beatles and Bob Dylan
would spend their entire careers on one label, because an artist was an
INVESTMENT. And the record labels stopped treating it like that, and I think
that's why the industry is in such decline. And of course that's now all
turning around, you know, metal bands are signing to labels for one album, and
they re-negotiate after the end, so thankfully the business is starting to
change. It just took so long and nearly destroying the industry itself to get
to that point.
Oh yeah. I have to say that you guys, over the pond there, were way ahead of
us. Because finally, I mean, and I know this from experience, because the ONLY
company that would reissue... And I didn't chase them they actually came to ME,
would release those two Ritual albums, was an American company! And even now,
here, it's REALLY hard for rock bands. Completely difficult, whereas, I do feel
in America, and a lot of my friends have gone there in the past and they're
still there... At least the opportunity is still there for them to play, and get
out there... Whether it's bars, or clubs or whatever. There's a lot more
places. Here, it's very small, and our population in this country is obsessed
with this really bad pop music (laughing).
- (laughing). The logistical nightmare of playing in the States is...
I'm not trying to brag on us but we're almost like a continent, so really what
you want to do is target the major cities and they're so spread out... It's
hard to get promotional coverage over the whole of the territory.
I've been a big follower all my life. Not by way of influence, but when I was
growing up, people like the Everly Brothers, Roy Orbison and all that stuff.
And what amazed me about a lot of those bands, people like Stevie Ray Vaughn
and stuff like that, they kind of became quite big in their own states first.
And that's really difficult to do here, even though we're a tiny country
compared to America. I think I read you know, you can get England into Kansas
like 7 times, which is really funny. (laughing here - Ed).
- When you think of Britain, though, you had Sabbath, you had the New
Wave Of British Heavy Metal Movement. You'd think that somewhere in the back of
the consciousness of Britain they would understand, you know "hey, a lot of the
British metal bands that really made it big CAME from here," so you think metal
would be a lot more popular in Britain to a degree.
It's absolutely incredible isn't it? I've got friends in the business that I've
known for years. Like Lemmy, god rest his soul, is an old friend of mine.
Sabbath and Ozzy we know well because you've got to remember all these bands
used the same studios. We were like a close knit family. We would often
rehearse at Rick's studios, which is way over near Wimbledon. That was one of
the better ones. Girlschool live just up the road from me here. The center of
New Wave Of British Heavy Metal was very much a London thing. Whereas heavy
metal, or heavier bands, came from the Midlands originally.
I don't know what it is about British people; they don't see the music that
we've produced as a cultural thing that we spread. Even Led Zeppelin, they
still kind of deny it. Over here, we recognize say, Jimi Hendrix and his
contribution, his MASSIVE contribution to music. But we don't recognize our
own, it's odd. We never got any support and we still don't.
- You guys mentioned that you had started back in '73, is there any
unreleased recordings, other songs or anything? It just seems like so long, 10
years between that and the debut.
Yeah, it's a long time, but you gotta remember the first few years... I would
say the first five years of that were spent just working, gigging, working,
sleeping... (laughs). And then trying to get somebody to back us. Labels
were not signing rock bands then, they just weren't. They were signing punk
bands. You're talking about the mid to late 70's. It was a bad time for rock
bands. And when we eventually DID get some money and start recording it was
probably I would say the late 70's. I got a few recordings, I have some early
recordings, but then again, they're on things like cassettes, there's a few
singles and stuff. It would need work. They could be remastered, we have had
stuff remastered. Again, this all takes, you know, somebody has to come to me
and say "Look, I'm really interested in some of the old stuff, how about we get
into that?" But of course, it's all about money; it's all about what they can
make out of you.
Recording and remastering costs a lot of money. There's a few albums that have
disappeared, because they were simply put out on cassette. There was an album
called "Gypsy" that was put out in 1985.
- Wow...
That's really good. We did an album called "Daughters Of Joy," which, that's
disappeared because the masters got... they got taken away because the
management company again got into debt, so we can't redo those at the moment.
There was a sort of EP called "Pandora's Wish," there's... Ah, I've got a whole
list here. What you're undertaking is quite an expensive venture. And they look
at the options, they think "these guys are getting on a bit now. Are we gonna
get our money back?" And that's the honest truth. It just is the hard way that
the business is run. And if Ritual ever reappears again with another album it
will probably be using some of the tracks I've been recording over the last one
or two years. We were always determined to put that third major album out on
vinyl. So that's what we've been working on really.
- You know, Shadow Kingdom would always be a good bet. There's a lot
of metal companies worldwide; there's Eat Metal out of Greece. There's even
Divebomb Recordings right here in the States. I've talked to Matt quite a bit;
he reissues a lot of rare and out of print 80's metal. That's what I was gonna
do years ago, start Vibrations Of Doom Records, but, you know, the capital.
Yeah, Shadow Kingdom is pretty good. It's just that I had a licensing deal with
them. And that actually runs out next year (which would be THIS year - Ed.) So
it's just one of things; I'd rather re-license to another company so I'll think
about that when the time comes... And I'm sure, I'm SURE there's a few metal
labels that would snatch up a new Ritual album. It's just making sure that all
the material is the kind of stuff that fans will expect, because they hear
Ritual in a certain way. And it HAS to be that way. It's very simplistic, it's
just of a certain atmosphere and aura, is what they like.
I've been asked to do gigs, and I said look I'm not going to do gigs unless we
could use a drummer that's suitable for the stuff, and the time or the venue is
right. But it's always in the background; I haven't deserted it at all. When
the band is quiet, I kinda do my own stuff. I actually started as a flamenco
player. I started at the age of nine; I used to play at theaters during
intermissions as a little flamenco player. My dad put me on stage doing that
stuff (laughs).
I'm sure you're gonna see something in the next year. We'd love to come back to
America, absolutely love to.
- Have you been here before?
We came here in 1972. This was before I formed Ritual. I was doing a little
stint with a band over there called Tranquility, with a friend of mine. They
released a few albums and they did quite well. Then he went on to become a
writer and wrote the stuff for Grease... You know, that crap. (laughs) I came
back after a year, and my bass player Steve he stayed there; he's been there
since then, but he died last year which was quite sad. But he kept saying "come
back, come back sometime and we'll sort out a tour so you can get some gigs."
- The Encyclopedia Metallium mentions something about "Naisha," a
video you had out in 1983, is the date on that right? I'm kinda curious about
that.
No, no, Naisha, which is apparently... It means the brightest star in Apache
apparently. It's actually off the "Valley Of The Kings." And it's the title
track. And there is a video, so yeah, I can send you the link for that. It's
pretty cool, you'll see my guitar in that. Which, before you ask me, I don't
have it now; it's in a private collection. I made two of them, which I used to
use in Ritual. It got sold to a private collector, because I used it for 10
years and it had it's day. Normally in the old days I used to use an SG but
this was just built for promos and all that. A bit of fun.
The actual video was filmed in Windsor Safari Park at the Egyptian Exhibition,
which is really cool. It's actually on location AND it was filmed by a BBC
producer, so it's quality film. It looks a bit dated now, but what can you do.
- You mention dark stuff; the lyrics for the first album are very
interesting to me. It's good that we have lyrics for the album, with as little
information as there is for you guys out there. There seems to be a lot of
interest in early 70's/late 70's early 80's occult oriented themes. You hear a
lot of that with 'Come To The Ritual,' 'Never For Evil,' 'Widow,' stuff like
that. So I'm curious as to your mindset when you were writing songs for that
first record; if you care to go that far back in history! (laughing here).
Yeah, I mean it's no mystery really. It's not that I'm a pagan or a cultist.
Like anybody else I'm fairly knowledgeable on some things. I think it all stems
from my theories on life. A lot of the things we see in the news, in the media
and stuff; it's all a ritual really. And our life is a ritual, and these
rituals stem from ancient times. And I'm a strong believer that we're all from
another place. But we still have these rituals and beliefs, stuff like that. I
don't actually believe anything I ever see. Unless you can sense it and feel it
yourself. I think everybody has their own kind of picture.
Like if you see something on Fox News, or whatever you guys watch over there.
You probably think the same as me you think "yeah, right, okay. Yeah, show me
the proof man." And I think that's a natural thing within all of us, because I
think instinctively we kind of know the truth.
- So you believe in that third eye vision?
Yeah, I've always been that way. I've always said "look, what is this all for,
why is that?" Don't look at that, look behind here, then look behind that and
go back to where it makes any sense. It's a crazy thing really, but I look at
people like (laughing here)... David Icke...
- You know, somehow I KNEW you were gonna mention him. I've seen some
of his work, especially where he talks about the Reptilian race. He's kinda out
there but he kinda makes sense too.
Yeah, I know, and you know what, that's the really bad thing. Because I say
"Listen, I know he's nuts (I'm laughing here). Okay?" That's fine, but WATCH
the video. Then tell me that you REALLY think he's nuts. Like, 9 out of 10
people say "you know what? That REALLY sounds like it, that could work for me."
Because EVERYTHING he's saying is true! There's no bullshit. The only time I
kinda switch off for him is when he starts going into like "we are all one
consciousness." Because we did all that shit in the 70's. And for me, that
doesn't work because I think we are all very individual consciousnesses.
Whether we are connected in SOME way, I'll agree with that. But I think he's
gone a little bit on the sort of hippy, dippy trip for me. (MUCH laughter from
me here).
But the other stuff; the other stuff's really good. And I think yeah, I think
we're all hybrids. We probably come from somewhere else, I mean it's just
practical data isn't it. I mean one day, WE will probably go to other worlds
and do the same thing won't we? We'll be dropping in planets all over the place
and that's if the planets are real or whatever, and we'll probably be putting
our own species there and doing all sorts. We're already tampering with life
ourselves NOW aren't we. So, I dunno why people find it so hard to believe
really.
- Truth is stranger than fiction, anyway.
What was that, like growing an ear on a mouse. People go "I don't believe David
Icke," but we're doing that shit already.
There's no strong occult connection, but I think it's all connected. With a lot
of the things; Like the ancient races, I think were very occult minded in the
way they lived their lives. Because it has some meaning from them that's passed
down is all, really. They were more idealistic, I suppose, like we all were.
What is it they say? "The dreams of youth become the regrets of maturity." I
don't believe in that, but I think as you get older, you kinda think "Yeah, I
was on the right track, definitely, but I'm still waiting for the answers, like
everybody." (laughter here on both sides).
- Absolutely, I agree. Me myself, I turned away from christianity a
long time ago; I couldn't relate to a god that just murders and destroys. I
kinda turned towards modern day spirituality, but also paganism. Because if you
look into christianity's roots, especially if you study into the Council Of
Nicaea... It's funny, you can get clues from history...
The thing that really gets to me the biggest about that Council Of Nicaea,
where Emperor Constantine... They took great pains to describe the clothing
that he was wearing at the meeting with the popes and the priests to basically
say that, "Well, you know, we can't SAY he's still a pagan but, this is what he
was wearing." And people that aren't clued in they have NO clue what that even
means. But, you look at that and it's an OBVIOUS clue... He wasn't really
worried about christianity, he just wanted to make sure that the money and
the merchants and the trade was still flowing in the right direction.
Absolutely. I mean, if you look into things like the gnostic scriptures and all
that stuff, and you wanna go way back. You suddenly start to see a pattern with
all these religions where "Hang on a minute! Doesn't that happen in the other
religion, they've just given it another name?" All the images start to become
REALLY common, and one of the most common images... I wear a bracelet all the
time, it's a snake: a serpent bracelet. Because the serpent is the oldest god
known to human kind; it goes RIGHT back to the Sumerians, right beyond that.
And I believe these images have been used... The serpent in christianity. And
in a lot of other religions; the Hindu religions and stuff like that. They just
use these ancient symbols and rituals... Again there you go! (laughing here).
Throughout so many different religions? You think "How can you people say
you're all kind of worshipping a different god, it's just like another story of
the same thing."
- No, absolutely, I agree with you 100%...
I think a lot of people turn away from religion, and especially christianity
because it's so rigid. They're saying, like for instance "thou shalt not lie."
Well, hang on a minute man, sometimes it IS good to lie. If your best friend is
dying of cancer and you don't want him to know, then you're gonna HAVE to lie,
aren't you? Or something has happened, and you're not telling the truth to
PROTECT somebody, how can that be wrong? So it's all these little things, they
kind of... It doesn't work does it? They're trying to make us live our modern
lives on texts that are like 2000 years old. But you go back 6 or 7 thousand
years, the story was the same? But they've all adapted it for their own
purposes.
- I think man ultimately is the defining or controlling influence.
Because you think about it, if religion can't adapt to the 21st century... I
mean a lot of those ancient texts were... They didn't have the technology to
deal with the things that we have nowadays. Religion is still blaming woman for
the downfall of man. Treating them like second class citizens... In this day
and age, how can you follow a religion where they DO that but yet we can put a
woman up for the highest seat of office on the planet, president of the United
States? It's SO outdated.
It comes back to that mind control thing. And I'm not pointing the finger at
ANY religion here, but I think we all know the ones that kind of brainwashed
and they're like sheep. And you just mentioned about the way women are treated
which I find REALLY appalling. REALLY appalling. My mum, god bless her, she's
at rest now but she was a great pusher for women's equality of rights. She
would have been APPALLED if she had known more about these kinds of things that
go on now. And I've kinda got that burned into me. I think we're all equal and
we all should be treated the same; I don't care who it is. But I just can't
understand the mentality that you've just brought up. How can you POSSIBLY like
a religion that denigrates women to such a point? To our Western values, it's
just appalling. We can't get our heads around it; it's just unbelievable! And I
think it all comes down to control.
Somebody said to me one day about god, they said "what do you think god is?"
And I said "I tell you what I think god is, I think it's us." We WILL one day
become our own god, however, I think we've got a long way to go. And I think
that's the most honest answer. I think some of us will aspire. Generations
thousand of years in the future; I think human beings WILL aspire to
something... Amazing! I think there'll be a passing of the ways with some
before that.
It's just some of those lines, isn't it? Just like "the meek shall inherit the
earth." Well, that's a load of crap, BUT there might be something in there. And
I truly believe the meek are the better part of us... And again, that's why
musicians like myself are involved in this, because I believe it feeds the
higher part of us. And I think if I do nothing else on this earth, if I can
make people feel good, then you've really achieved something positive rather
than... I dunno, either preaching religion or creating some kind of terror
attack or to do something real bad, you know. I think we're the good guys. I
do, we're the good guys, that's it...
- That's a good way to look at it. But you know, when we talk about
the Occult... Like I said, the ancients had knowledge. Mezzadurus from Blood
Storm, I interviewed him and he said basically that the occult really is just
undiscovered science. It's practices you can put into application that work.
But the religious people don't understand that. They don't understand that it's
not black magic or witchy voodoo or whatever. It's undiscovered science,
basically, it's the simplest way to put that.
And I'd go a step further, and I'd say it's actually FORGOTTEN science. Once
upon a time there was probably a civilization knew ALL this stuff. Before the
thing they call the fall of man. And I truly believe that makes a LOT of sense
to me. Where at some point things changed, here, I don't know when and we
became what we are now. And I just think now, we're kinda on that road where
we're learning all this stuff again. It's almost like infinity is a cycle or a
figure eight. It all kinda goes around. When they talk about infinity, I think
that's what happens. Things just keep going round and round. And the occult
will ALWAYS be in our lives.
I mean, if you look even at the christian ceremonies, I mean LOOK at it, those
Catholic sermons man. All that regalia, the altars, all the paraphernalia, it's
an frikkin' occult ritual isn't it? It's all still there, it's just been given a
different name hasn't it?
- Absolutely. I didn't think of it that way.
I mean, what is the pope if he isn't a high priest? That's what he is, isn't
he?
- So I wanna ask you a question, I have been really interested in
this particular... I don't wanna say "sermon," but there's been a lecture given
by some university professors in your country. Fascinating topic where he talks
about that... Of course you look at Jesus' life, and you see where he emulates
kind of the peaceful nature of the Buddah. But basically what THEY'RE saying is
that Jesus Christ was a psychological warfare invention of the Roman Empire.
You know, because you had the Jewish masses who refused to worship the Caesars
as gods, and you had the pagans and they were trying to keep them all in line.
The Jews rejected Jesus as the messiah; it makes me wonder if they rejected him
because A. they either KNEW that he was a psychological invention of the Roman
Empire, a psychological warfare tactic, or they thought that Jesus didn't fit
the model of what the messiah was supposed to be according to their ancient
texts.
Yeah, I mean I think what you're saying has QUITE a lot of validity. And we
tend to think of psychological warfare as like, recent. But it's PERFECTLY
feasible to think this could have happened. Absolutely, I TOTALLY agree with
that. Because let's face it, again we come back to the powers that be. There
will ALWAYS be powers that be that wish to divide and rule. Now, that's a
PERFECT way to do it, isn't it? And you know, whichever millenium you live in,
there's always gonna be controlling powers that want to invent things to
control the population.
And I don't know enough about it to kinda make an educated comment, but it
sounds NOT a million miles from what could have happened.
- The sad thing about it; we ALL want to know the truth BUT... The
truth, in whatever form it takes, has been buried by hundreds if not thousands
of years of time and dust.
Oh gosh, yes, still doing it. You can talk about anything from governments to
the moon landing, to Princess Di. And I truly believe so many of these things
are an illusionary fake by the powers that be to create something. And again,
it's to create more control or to generate more money (which allows more
control). And it's all part and parcel of the same thing. You can go way way,
way back; I'm sure most of the wars have been created for that purpose. We've
had recent examples, the Iraq war and things like that. And we KNOW that our
government schemed to get us into it, whether we should have been there or
not. All wars are pointless, because people just die and that's it. There's no
result and nothing changes. It's just there for a purpose.
I think there's an American president who said... I dunno which one it was, but
he said "war is good business." And you know, that sort of thing is always
ringing in my head. And not because he's kinda of THAT person, what do you call
them... an Illuminati? But I'm sure the people above him are. I'm actually
convinced that 1% of this planet is running the other 99%. My dad was a
freemason, he was a mason. Yeah. I've been invited to join several times, but I
just can't get into that secret society. It's not for me. He was the very low
level mason. But you know, the people at the top of those organizations are
EXTRAORDINARILY secretive. You NEVER know... their hand is in this, that and the
other and you NEVER know... And the masons are a very ancient... A very, very
ancient kind of secretive order, like many of them.
I mean, our royal family. They're related to SO many people. They proved how
many American presidents are actually distantly related to, which is REALLY
freaky. Again, it all comes back to that control thing. I think we're all stuck
here; we're all stuck in it. And there's not a lot we can do about it. But it's
sort of nice to know. I'd rather know that not know. It's best to be careful.
- Sometimes knowledge is a scary thing though. I got involved with
religions in the past, and if you thought the hellfire thing was scary, there's
other religions with beliefs for the eternal punishment. And it can leave a
scarring effect, I know it did on me.
Religions; a little knowledge is dangerous. And people tamper with all sorts of
things like, whatever. Because they think it's a bit trendy, they'll go out and
buy the Key Of Solomon or Aleister Crowley book and before you know it... they
are painting their room black and getting involved in all sorts of stuff. The
problem is that they don't realize that it's only making them more vulnerable
and open to negative forces that they simply don't understand and could NEVER
control. I'm a VERY strong believer in don't mess with what you don't know.
There's SO many things in this world we've yet to sort of grasp fully. We don't
even know who's controlling US! And whoever is controlling us, they're masters
of this kind of manipulation. And all sorts of influences and powers that we,
we don't know. And I think getting sucked in is part of their... I dunno what
their plan is, but I think their plan was originally... so the story goes... I
mean the Sumerians were taken over by these... I dunno, these alien beings or
whatever. Because they were mining for some stuff here and they needed... There
was only 600 of them apparently. These forces or beings from another dimension
wanted to enslave the human race so they got millions of people to mine this
crap for them...
- It was gold, I think...
Yeah! And I think that, even if it's true or it's not true, it's STILL going on
today. We're working... You know, whoever goes to work... I mean, even the
queen, even these sort of people, the queen, the president or whatever...
They're ALL working in the pyramid aren't they? They're in the pyramid scheme,
in some kind of pyramid system. We're the bottom, and these guys might be
halfway up but they're CERTAINLY not at the top. Absolutely not.
- Well I guess that's enough on the... philosophical aspect... (MUCH
laughter on both sides here). I usually love those kinds of interviews you
know?
Ah, we've solved the problems of the world, I mean that's it.
- Well, there's a lot more behind musicians than just the music and
the day-to-day workings of the music industry.
The music industry is a very... for anybody coming into it... I mean I had a
guy the other day who's kids were going into it said "look, can you give me any
advice," and I said alright, "have you got a spare week?" (laughing here - Ed).
Because there's just SO much to know. Yeah, once upon a time, you were a
musician, you got your guitar, and you played a few gigs and it was cool, you
could do your thing. Now it's a lot different; it's very complicated. Nowadays
musicians have got all the gear and no idea. Their basic abilities sometimes
leave a bit to be desired. But that doesn't matter, because mummy and daddy
bought them a nice Gibson, and they can afford to rehearse at a good studio
and you know, dad's best friend works at a record company. So it's all that
kind of stuff going on still. But so much more of it because there's so many
musicians now. Everybody wants to be a Star. It's a bit of a minefield and old
fogies like myself, we just kinda... I like Willie Nelson who just tracks along
with his old beat up guitar and that's it, that'll do it you know? (laughing
here yet again - Ed).
Yeah, you got to be pragmatic about it, I never blow my own trumpet, I say that
I'm just the guitar player, I dunno. We just enjoy the music, which I think the
people like myself came into it as a kid from that. The money, if you make some
money, that's nice; if you don't... Well, if you love the music that will
sustain you through. But I mean I wonder how many of these sort of young pop
artists we got out here now, what they're gonna be doing when they're 50; I'm
not sure.
- They'll probably be unknown and unheard of by that point. Because
it just seems to me like, you know with American Idol... And those kinda shows
REALLY grate my nerves because the record companies shifted to trying to put
out these one hit wonders, make as much money from them as they can... If you
don't make gold by your first record, you practically get dumped, and that's
why the music industry is in the state it's in. (laughing). ONE of the reasons.
I'm not a big fan of Mickey Rourke. I mean, I've not seen many of his films. I
like him as an actor, because I liked him in Iron Man. (laughing here) I only
liked that film because it's good a good soundtrack. He was taking a taxi
somewhere and somebody said to him I dunno, something about Justin Bieber or
something, and he said well, do you like him? And he said, "ah, he's just a
punk ass bitch." "What's all this..." and he was doing all the rap movements,
he goes "what's all this?" And it's true because in a way it's a kind of... I
mean, rap isn't my favorite music but it's kind of disrespecting real, proper
rap artists. Isn't it? Some kind of skinny, middle class kid thinking he's down
with the boys. (HUGE laughter breaking out on both sides). I did laugh. And
Mickey Rourke was right on the nose I have to say.
- I think you call them "townies" over there. I heard that was a
very... I love that term "townies." (laughing heavily here).
Oh yeah, we got all sorts of words for them here. British rock musicians, we're
sort of quite down to earth really. And most of us come from... Because in
America, you don't have like a class system like we've got here. It's a bit
less defined. I mean, yeah, you got people with money and people without money.
But here, it's a bit more complicated. It's kind of where you come from, who
your parents were and all that stuff. Do you have any money. Social classes are
a bit... I dunno, it's hard to explain, but I come from a sort of an upper, a
more upper working class background. We weren't trailer trash but good working
class people. You've probably got that there in the States I know.
- Oh yeah.
There's a bit of rivalry because most of the rock bands are really kinda
working class. And there was an invasion in the sort of late 80's and 90's with
the prog rock bands, and they were, funny enough, they were mostly middle class
bands along the lines of Pink Floyd who... The funny thing about Pink Floyd, the
middle class probably laughed at them, most of the rock musicians go "yeah
right. Well, that's great. Sit in the studio for two years, man, right, far
out." They're not really that impressed.
But on the other hand, we've got the people here they absolutely adore the old
bands like The Who, The Beatles, The Kinks, the Stones. Because they're just
like me, and they REALLY worked hard. So yeah, Motorhead, all the later bands.
All the New Wave bands; Black Sabbath, oh god, Iron Maiden. Even Eric Clapton.
They're kind of all great people; they're not privleged in any way. It's that
kind of inspirational thing where you know... Jimi Hendrix came from NOTHING.
He was from NOTHING, but look what you get. You get EVERYTHING from NOTHING.
And you know, that's always an inspiration to younger people. Where, they've
kind of lost that inspiration now, because they look on the T.V. like you say
at these talent shows, and they think "Hey, I could do that!" Yet you LOWER the
level of expectation of professionalism. It's just LOWERED. I dunno why. But it
just seems to have gone that way. Young guitar players... And I'm not being
biased; I look at them and think "my god, these guys on the T.V." I seen guys
on youtube, and I'm like "what are you doing?"
- I think it's lowered, because you forget that you have to put the
time and the effort to... I mean, I consider myself a decent singer NOW. But I
probably wasn't 15 or 20 years ago. I practiced... You have to work at it!
Yeah. Same with me, absolutely. I wasn't born a singer. Because when Ritual
formed it was a four piece band in 1973 (WOW - Ed). And the lineup was Steve
Smith on drums, Les Haynes on bass, Graham Fox on vocals, and myself. And
Graham suffered from a LOT of throat problems over the next year. And he left.
And I had a couple of singers after that; temporary singers. Funny enough, one
was an American guy who was pretty cool. A guy called John Mitchell. And
eventually I got fed up with these guys coming and going. I said, I'll have a
go at it myself. And we ended up as a three piece because I was doing the
vocals. That was sort of in about '75. So I kinda had to start singing, but
like yourself I had to work at it. And it wasn't easy. If you really like what
you're doing, like you say, you put the time in and do the work.
When you look at these young people, somebody could have gone along and said,
"look, what you've got is good, but look! Just go in and work at it for
awhile. And so that's really good because you've OBVIOUSLY got talent." And
THEN come back and make a future of it. Don't make it NOW, right? (laughing).
But they don't. It's like "look at me, I bought a guitar last week. Now I'm
gonna tell you something about this Les Paul thing that I've got." No, don't
tell us because we all know! It's so funny. After my bass player and I,
we're really bored and we're really fed up, we want to come and youtube,
because they DO cheer you up (laughter here on both sides - Ed). God bless
these little... No but bless 'em. I seriously, absolutely wish them all the
luck. Because it's hard. You know? I wanna bring 'em up and say "listen,
LISTEN! Keep it up, keep working at it man, and by the way, get your thumb off
the top of the neck! (HUGE laughter from both of us here). And sit more
confortably, you look really bad, you're gonna get wrist problems, like I've
got now; I've got wrist problems, I've got finger problems. 54 years down the
line, that's what happens.
You learn as you go along. And that's what I wanna do, because they're kids!
It's the next generation coming through.
- I wanted to ask you... I know the title of the album is called
"Widow." And maybe you had a visual image of who the Widow actually was. I
mean, apparently she had lost her husband, but she seems to have this mystical
kind of... You mentioned in the lyrics she's a Black Widow. I'm just kinda
curious about the background of the Widow.
I think my image of a Widow has always been soberly because love and beauty for
me are two of the most important factors in life. And in music for me it HAS to
be something beautiful, because I DON'T relate to ugliness. There's plenty of
ugliness in the world; you can step out into the street. If you're an artistic
person, you want to see things in a kind of... And that's just how I see
things; I'll see something good in everything, that's me. Because I think
everything's kind of got it's own beauty. Even if it's a kind of ugly beauty.
You know what I'm saying. I'll give you a good example; you'll see some women
and they're kind of ugly and yet they're STRANGELY appealing. It's like that.
So when I was actually writing the song, I had an image of a person, a lady if
you like, who lost a loved one, but she was quite young when she lost him. And
I think when something like that happens to you, when you lose somebody very
young, I think it can almost kind of, in a way, it colors your soul into black
color. And you've got this kind of darkness that surrounds you. It all sounds
very weird but I kind of perceived it as a very sad, dark, black thing. Now
the Widow ever lost that by falling in love again; which I hope she did, of
course. But at that moment in her life I saw her in a very lonely place, alone,
lost, without anybody that loved her. Because that person is gone. And I think
that's a VERY black and dark place to be in life. Doesn't matter who you are.
You can see where I'm going with that.
I was a lot younger then, it was my idealistic view of how it looks when you've
lost everything. It's this term Widow. When I was a kid, they used to say to
me, "oh, that's Mrs. Schwarzenegger over there, she's a Widow, you know?" Like
some kind of black bags they put on women. Because it was also considered not
very nice for Widows to be hanging around single men. It was odd, for Widows
were meant to be kind of... Remember I grew up after the war, so there were
still a lot of the old values around people think that Widows should remain
faithful to their dead husband.
In this country we had a lot of Italians that settled at that time. But the
Widows wear black for like 7 years. And they did it even when they were living
here. Some of them 10 years. And you see this kind of... I dunno she's lost her
husband, she's quite attractive, 30 year old woman, she's all dressed in black.
And that's just how it was and I suppose from a kid that made an imprint on my
mind. The Widow image to me is something really awful, and kind of mourning.
There's a HUGE sadness to it, like when you listen to Handel. If you listen to
Handel, there's this kind of immense sadness in the music that's just... awful.
You listen to it, I tell ya. I can't listen to it very much, because it's got
this almost an air of despair about it. You feel that the writer thinks this
horrible, horrible sad, inevitability of life.
- Doom metal is kind of like that too.
Yeah. If I write something sad, often they're instrumentals. I write a lot of
instrumentals like that. If you take 'The Enchanted Princess' off of "Valley Of
The Kings," that's quite sad. 'Subrosa' which is a late one which I wrote for
somebody special I've known in my life. That was kinda... that's sad as well.
She was a well known glamour model here in the 60's. I met her when I was quite
young. And I had that SAME feeling when I wrote "Widow." What about, I don't
know, because in that time it was '93, and I really didn't have anything to be
unhappy about.
I think it was Eric Clapton who said, "when you write something, you have to go
to a place where you can't take anybody with you." He's right, you just have to
sort of look within yourself, and let it come out really.
- Finally, I guess the last question I wanted to ask: I'm REALLY
curious about some of the bands you used to play with back in the day and what
some of those shows were like.
Oh, they were fantastic. In the early days we used to do a lot of shows in the
West End. There were a couple of clubs there we used to do called the Temple in
Wardour Street. And of course you know we played at the Marquee many times. At
the Temple, we'd be on the same bill with UFO and The Pretty Things. And later
on of course with Motorhead. We didn't support Sabbath at the Odeon; we were
supposed to. They picked a band... You'd have to look REALLY deep into the
archives, because they asked us to do it and we couldn't do it. A band called
720 did it. It's a crazy, crazy world, but I think we supported MOST of the
70's bands over the years.
That was UFO in it's pre-Schenker days. Michael Schenker who I know, we met at
the Liver studios in Victoria many, MANY years ago. In fact, I bought a silver
fox fur jacket I used to wear, I bought off of him. He's a really nice guy,
Michael. He's one of the few people in this business who, if you listen to his
playing, there's a lot of love and soul in it. Just listen, he's a beautiful
player, he really is. He's a VERY nice guy. As are many people in the business.
You just don't get a chance for honest... There's a lot of really good, hard
working decent people. And I always say to people on ANY show that's
listening... DON'T believe all the crap you read about the drugs and the sex
and drinking. (laughing here - Ed). Some of it's true, of course it is, but
underneath all that, there's a LOT of hard working guys out there trying to
just give of themselves to entertain everybody. You know, that's the bottom
end, and at the end of that of course we're all human.
I suppose the last bigger band we supported was one called Stormtrooper. That
was towards the end of when we were kind of packing up really. Oh, and Mama's
Boys of course. So many of them really. We almost went on a bill with
Girlschool, but to be honest with you, there was management problems there.
Because their management company was not the same as ours. But in the mid 90's
was when things started to fade out, because they started closing all the
venues down. We didn't have the management that would have put us on some of
the bigger places. A lot of those gigs kinda wore out really, it was a shame.
WARBEAST.
Interview with our thrash legend, Bruce Corbitt via phone.
This is one of the most difficult interviews I've ever had to conduct. The tone
changes QUITE drastically from beginning to especially middle, when the full
revelation hits Bruce about how I felt about the last Rigor Mortis album
"Slaves To The Grave." I mean, here is one of my fucking IDOLS, one of my most
favorite metal luminaries of all fucking time, and I have to reveal to him how
disappointed I was with their last release. So we're both trying to work this
out, and of course I'm in full defence mode while still trying to maintain the
respect and dignity that this man has shown me throughout my entire career. Add
to this all that as of this writing, Bruce was fighting for his life and going
into a life threatening surgery, and I gotta tell you, this had me sweating
bullets by the conversation's end. Still, this ought to tell you how hard I
pushed to get Bruce to BELIEVE he was going to beat cancer, and still be around
for us, ALL of us, who are some of his most devoted and diehard fans.
At the time of this writing, Bruce was on his way into the hospital yet again
to fight for his life, literally...
- So how are you doing, man, I know you had some health concerns; we
were all really worried about you for awhile, how's that going?
It's still going pretty bad, you know, just dealing with cancer and heart
disease. It's pretty fucked up, you know?
- We all hate to hear that shit; we all hope you kick this shit's ass
and get back out there.
I'mma do my best man. Like I said it's not looking good but I'm trying to beat
it and survive; that's life. I don't have any idea about being able to perform
again right now, it doesn't look like any chance you know?
- It's such a shame; the metal world has lost so many great people.
Dimebag, Paul Baloff from Exodus, we lost... Sheesh man, I could sit here all
day and talk about all the people... Quorthon from Bathory, Juhani Palomaki
from Colosseum, I mean the list goes on and on. I know we're getting older, but
you gotta wonder how the metal world is gonna survive in the next 50 years, you
know?
Yeah, I know. It's getting sad, like you said the list is pretty big and
getting longer every month. I'm lucky to have these chances to try and beat it;
at least, you know, I didn't just drop dead immediately. I got a little bit of
fight left in me.
- So I wanna talk about this new project; well, it's not a new
project obviously. You'd think me doing the music magazine for 25 years that
nothing would slip under my radar. But it seems like the Warbeast project
started out as the Texas Metal Alliance. I'm kinda curious as to why you felt
the need to change the name. Texas has a long and very kick ass and proud
history in the metal scene, even though it's not as prominent as Tampa, or
Stockholm, or the black metal capitals of the world.
Yeah, well, we thought long and hard about the name and whether we should
change it or not. The main reason was the fact that so many people didn't
understand that it was an actual, serious band. And it wasn't just some kind of
metal support group or something. I think the name was confusing people a lot.
As great as Texas is, and we're proud of it and love to represent it, we also
didn't want people to think it was like that, made for Texans only or something
(laughing here)
We didn't do it easily, because we knew we'd have to say "formerly Texas Metal
Alliance" for a year or two, and that's never an easy thing. In the end, before
we put out any official albums or anything, we did make the name change. It
didn't get even more confusing having some releases out there already (laughs).
- Well, it's not like Warbeast isn't a kick ass name anyway. You
think about nowadays, metal is over 40 years old, and you go (pause) "How come
somebody HADN'T thought of the name Warbeast as a fucking band name yet," you
know?
Well, it's almost impossible to find a name that hasn't been thought up. And
there was already some other bands that had been using Warbeast, or had used it
for awhile. It sometimes comes down to who gets signed first, who gets legal
rights to the name. I looked it up and found a few that had used it but they
broke up or whatever. Just like there's 20 or 30 Rigor Mortis'es out there!
(laughing)
- Yeah, there's a few... There's a couple of Overkill's out there
too; there was a punk band called Overkill too, and I was like, "Oh, shit,
okay!"
Yeah, it's crazy. So right after we did decide to go with Warbeast, another
band that had started using it around the same period... They were from Europe
though, but they were like "Well, we thought of it last year!" And we were like
well, y'all might have started using it before we changed the name, but we're
putting out an album, and it's kinda like I said earlier; whoever puts out
an album first usually ends up owning the rights to the name. So that band had
to change their name to Warbeast Remains. Add a second name to it, you know
what I mean?
- Well, I think that has a lot too with territorial issues. Because
I've seen several band names that, okay, like this is Attacker from the U.S.,
and then there's an Attacker from Norway and hell, there might even be one from
Japan. But I guess it all depends on how big the band gets and whether they
make a push into overseas markets. I'm not sure how all that works, but I guess
you guys won the battle (laughing).
It's a confusing thing. I've been through it all before because of the Rigor
Mortis thing. It just depends on how far we wanna push it if we really want to
mess with this band that's using it in Russia, or some other territory. We have
the legal rights to the name, and if we really wanted to mess with them we
could. A lot of them bow down gracefully once they find out they don't have
legal rights to it. And I don't see anyone getting super huge or rich and
famous out there under the name Rigor Mortis or Warbeast so (much laughter here
on both sides) you know, we haven't really had to do anything.
- When I talked to Liz Ciavarella this morning (Earsplit PR), she
seemed overly excited that I was doing this interview. And I'm sitting here
thinking... I hope you guys have been doing a lot of press for this new release
and this band, have you done a lot of interviews lately?
I have been more recently in the last couple of weeks. But we've had trouble...
Usually Liquid Metal, Jose and them over at Sirius Satellite have been playing
all of our previous albums, and for whatever reason he's not responding, and
none of them are playing anything off this new album. And that's a little bit
of a discouragement you know, as far as what's happened before. We're still
getting lots of press and interviews and doing these releases, but you take
away that airplay there and then us not being able to go out and tour in the
future to support the album. She's happy and we're happy to do anything we can
as far as getting any kind of press. I don't know if you saw the music video
that just came out, our film just came out 2 hours ago...
- Damn! No, I haven't, I just got home!
You'll have to check it out, it's an 18 minute film, starring the dude from the
Texas Chainsaw Massacre. So we've been excited, waiting for this day to come to
release this video. I'm sure she was just happy to give me another good
interview, she might have seen the one we did from years ago.
- You still remember that interview, huh?
Yeah, dude, I do!
- That's cool. I appreciate that, man. I put a lot of thought into
it. I was gonna add this as a question too, and I almost hate to bring this up,
but Phil's been having a LOT of trouble in the press lately, and I'm wondering
if that's why you guys have been unceremoniously kinda blacklisted over there
at Sirius. He said a few things he may or may not should have, and the next
thing is everybody's going "oh, you see this video where's he's on stage
screaming ''White Power...''" or whatever? First of all, it pisses me off, this
is the METAL scene, not playtime at the mall. In America you're supposed to be
able to say whatever the fuck you want, joking or not! Shit, I've interviewed
Arghoslent before, I'm like "fuck it," but I also interviewed Hirax in the same
damn issue. Fuck all the politics, fuck all the bullshit, extreme music... It's
almost like the shit's getting watered down these days. I'm like "What the fuck
is going on?" to our metal scene; it's like metal's not dangerous anymore!
Yeah, it's uh... It's a joke. I mean I can't say for sure. You know, it's been
a year and a half since he made that comment. He went through quite a bit when
it first happened. I think he's actually been on Sirius since then, so I'd be
surprised if that's it, but you never know.
- You NEVER know. Yeah, all these social justice warriors. I tell ya,
the internet to me is a double edged sword these days. Well, obviously I
wouldn't have a music magazine without the 'net, but it seems like... The
"pussification" of America, it's really fucking depressing me, it's almost like
they're wanting to change EVERYTHING. Like metal can't be heavy and kick ass
anymore, it's got to cater to ANTIFA and all these PC fucks and all this
shit... The Norwegians were really onto something when they were burning all
these churches and killing each other! (laughing)...
Ha haha! Right! I hear ya man (Bruce is finding that statement hilarious). No
telling what's going on; Jose could just be having a busy month on vacation.
No telling man; blackballed because of Phil... I don't think that's it.
- I hope not.
We've got quite a few good reviews for the album, and the only difference this
year is like I said we're usually being played on that, and unfortunately we
would be ready to get out and support this album with a lot of touring, but we
had to break up the band and me retire and all kinds of crazy unfortunate
bullshit.
- Well, your health is more important than anything else... I hope
you believe that!
No other choice. I shouldn't have even made it when the tumor started
internally bleeding and stuff, but somehow I did survive and I made it through
the chemo and the radiation and now I've got my big, really serious surgery on
the 28th (which already happened - Ed.) that I hope I make it through.
- Yeah, I'm hoping this ain't the last time I talk to you. MY hope
is, because I've never got to see Warbeast live, so you need to get your ass
back to Atlanta! That should be a goal you should be working towards!
No, we got lucky to play there a few times, hopefully and if a miracle
happens... But the band's all broken up and went their own way, so if it does
happen it won't be anytime soon or anything real easy to pull off. It's
definitely going to be a couple of years down the road man. The surgery's gonna
be so hard to survive and then recover from as it is.
- But you gotta believe you can do it man...
Oh yeah...
- I come from a spiritual place, man. You need to SEE the surgery and
the recovery as already having happened in your mind, that's how you're going
to survive it. Trust me. My son's mom had spinal meningitis. And you don't
survive that shit, but she's still alive to this day. In fact, they kept her in
the hospital for three months, and she told me that the only thing she had
pictured in her mind was she was going to survive this shit, and that's just
all there was to it. That's what you gotta do man, I KNOW you can do it.
Well, I am, I mean like I said there's no cure for this cancer that I got,
and they can only treat it not cure it. Very few people live a certain amount
of years. Like I said. I'm not laying here like "oh, I'm about to die." Gotta
think positive and think I got a chance to beat it, but I'm also realistic
about it. There's so many people out there... I don't know if they're just
doing it to try to help me through it or whatever, but um, they're like "Aww,
you got this easy!" (he's laughing here). It ain't gonna be that easy but I'm
gonna do my best and I am gonna fight and beat this shit; if anybody can it's
gonna be me. Like I said, I'm just realistic and knowing the seriousness of
what I'm going through.
- Look at Nergal from Behemoth, he went through, pretty much,
somewhat the same thing. And I've read about... Miracles happen all the time,
and I'm of the belief that the mind controls the reality, the situation around
you. And as long as your mind is strong you can create the sort of reality you
want to have. And man, I... (long pause here to try and figure out the right
thing to say here - this is hard). I would go apeshit if something happened to
you; you know you've always been very supportive of me and everything that
we've done. And this is an interview, I'm like look if I gotta quit my job for
this...
(laughing here). I appreciate it though, dude. You know, I'm a fighter; I've
already beat death several times over the course of my life, and a few times
recently. And like I said I'm doing good considering all I've been through,
and I'm just less than two weeks away, so we'll know soon how I do with the
surgery. It's not an easy situation with the heart disease and the cancer, but
like I said if anyone can do it it's gonna be me.
- You know, with all the deaths that the metal scene has had, it's
time for somebody to come up and say "alright man, you know... Here's the big
success story. Fuck cancer, fuck heart disease, I beat all that shit!"
(laughing) Yeah well I'm hoping. I'm lucky to still be here as it is,
unfortunately for Mike Saccacia from Rigor Mortis, he didn't get the second or
third chances to fight for his life like I did, but I'm grateful I still got
this chance. 'Cause like you said, we keep losing people every day and the list
keeps getting longer man.
- Kind of on a different topic here, I still remember that Rigor
Mortis show very fondly. Because obviously I was more of a fan of the first
album that you were on. But you know, from a historical perspective, it was
neat to be able to sit there and say man, from one fucking show, I got to see
two eras of Rigor Mortis in one night. And what I'm thinking about now, I
don't know if you're into... I'm pretty sure you're into Dark Angel, I know
you know who they are. I'm sitting here thinking, you know, these guys need to
get over the fucking shit... Bring out Don Doty for the "We Have Arrived" and
"Darkness Descends" era, let Ron Rineheart do his thing.
I gotta hand my hat to you; when you guys did that reunion show, you guys did
it with class and respect, even though they didn't let you play the two songs
you wanted to perform, I was like "this is how a reunion should be." Everybody
that was involved in the band, SHOULD be involved in the band. And Don Doty
wasn't just a singer on one... He was the singer for like two albums... He was
a HUGE part of their early success, and to leave him out to me is just
criminal.
Well, the thing was we were definitely going through there (the Atlanta area -
Ed.) and we were gonna see Doyle so it just made sense to go ahead and let him
get up and be part of that night. Since we lost Mike, it's almost been 5 years
but we've done a few shows to honor him around here. We didn't call it Rigor
Mortis, but we called it like... One time we called it the Saccacianators...
- Wizard Of Gore...
And then, yeah the Wizards Of Gore, we called it that. But one time we were the
Saccacianators, and did a big thing for Mike and Doyle got up and was part of
that as well. And recently he came down and was part of a thing where we added
Mike Saccacia to the Texas Musicians' Museum, it was about two months ago and
unfortunately it was after I found out I couldn't perform anymore. So I once
again asked Doyle if he would come in and sing and a few other singers around
here to fill in for me. I became really good friends with Doyle, and even
though we're on different albums, we're still part of the same band and whether
I was the original singer or not, it just seemed right that he should be
included in some of our reunion shows, you know?
- It's a shame more bands don't feel that way. I understand; there's
drama on both sides of the camp. Jim Durkin has made it very clear that he
wants Ron Rhineheart. Maybe Don got a little over excited and started saying
things before time. But I actually did an interview with Don Doty for Dark
Angel (RIGHT here in this issue!) and he had a completely different take on
it. But you never really know where the truth meets in the middle. They need to
find a way to work past that and bring Don Doty back. Because that's what the
fans want. Most people that I've talked have said they WANT to see Doty back on
the stage. I've heard his Eliminator stuff, his Dark Angel covers. He's STILL
got it after all these years; there's NO doubt about that!
Right! Did you see the Rigor Mortis documentary I did?
- No I need to look into that, definitely!
Yeah. Well, it only goes up through the earliest days of where we all started
and then up to when we got signed to Capitol. But I plan on doing part two as
soon as I beat all this cancer bullshit.
- There you go, so you got a goal to look forward to!
Yeah! I got to tell the rest of the story, which you know after the first album
and I got fired, I got Doyle's coming in and then we go all the way back to when
we reunited and did our final album together. I'm the one in charge of doing the
documentary, but I'm definitely going to be fair and tell Doyle's part of the
story.
- Now I'm kinda curious about something. As far as Warbeast goes, do
you guys all sit down together and write the songs and lyrics? Cause this is
like your third full length out now? Do you guys all collaborate, because I'm
telling you, I'm hearing a lot of really catchy, sharp fucking sick thrash
riffs, and I'm thinking, is that Scott Shelby from Gammacide doing that shit?
The riffing is vicious man, there's no doubt about that!
That was a cool thing, because when we formed this band we couldn't get Rigor
Mortis, or Gammacide or any of those bands to play for this benefit we were
gonna do for our friend Wayne Admy from Hammerwitch. That's why we kinda came
up with the idea to.. hey, it's Bruce from Rigor Mortis, and let's get Scott
and Rick from Gammacide, a couple of dudes from Rotting Corpse. And you know,
all team up and play 2 songs by each bands. And rotate some guest musicians and
rotate out as we play each band's songs. And after that we had such fun jamming
with the Gammacide dudes, that they brought it up, like "you know, we can't do
Gammacide fulltime and you can't do Rigor Mortis fulltime, so we should do this
you know, give us something else to do."
The history of where the bands came from and us knowing each other goes way
back, and then we just work so well together. As far as the writing, we've had
different members for each album. So it's kinda been a little different for how
we do each album. But we don't all sit down together all at the same time and
write. Usually Scott and the guitarist, which is a lot of times been Scott's
only founding member besides me. But he'll get together with the drummer and
the other guys and write some stuff at home, bring it in and show them. And
they'll try and come up with some stuff on the spot. But once they get their
blueprint laid out for the songs and the music, then I start hearing it, then
I add my part later. We all know our roles in the band and I usually just give
those guys the freedom to come up with some music, and if I hear anything I'll
throw in a suggestion. But most of the time I let them work it out and then I
get to have fun adding the subjects and the lyrics I wanna write about.
- I don't know if you've been following what I've been doing; I
recorded clean sung vocals for the blackened doom band Darkflight from
Bulgaria. It was interesting, because it was supposed to be one song, but he
loved my vocals so much it turned into three. A lot of people don't realize
though that not every vocalist writes their own lyrics. All the stuff I sing on
this album I wrote, but it's just I wrote my parts for songs he already had
titled out. BUt a lot of people, even I had a misconception for awhile, that
you know "oh, the guy's a singer, he's a frontman, he probably writes all the
lyrics because he's singing them, etc. etc." But some vocalists are just hired
help, and shit, it took me almost 15 - 20 years to learn that! (laughs) Me
being in Hallows Eve especially, it kinda was a different thing.
Yeah, and I mean I'll be the first to admit that I'm not the type of singer
that writes all the lyrics to every sung I've ever sang; not at all. I've
always been very open and cool about having other guys write, whether it be
that they wanted to or they're really good at it, or I needed some help or I
couldn't write all the songs myself. It's just different reasons why over the
years I haven't done it. The album before this, I wrote EVERY song. This is one
I just wanted to do it all (laughs). But on this one I was back to being open
to having a few of the songs being written by Scott or somebody else. And we
did the last Rigor Mortis album, same thing, I was cool with Harden and Casey
helping out with writing. It depends on how the situation is with the band and
if the singer's "the main guy." Some singers are just like "I'm gonna do it
all." or whatever. Some guys like me are like "Cool, let's all write" because
it adds variety.
- I tell ya, one of the saddest things for me was... (this is where
the interview definitely takes a nosedive for me, I keep thinking I shouldn't
have mentioned this - Ed.) I don't know how you're gonna feel about this, I
almost hate to admit it to you, but the last Rigor Mortis album, I definitely
wasn't crazy about it. I really felt bad about that, because I realize it was
kinda a different slant. I thought 'Flesh For Flies' was the best track on that
album, and I felt like if there was anything that sounded like a return to the
early days of Rigor Mortis, THAT was the track. I started not to even review the
album (that was another bad mistake, admitting that I reviewed it - Ed.)
I didn't get any bad feedback about it, but it was one of those times when I
thought maybe should just not review it you know, because I realized it was
Mike's last effort...
Especially when the first two months of reviews are like we were getting 9's
and tens, and everybody was raving, and it was the best feedback on any album.
And we all still believe it's our best album by far. So... I mean if I had saw
what you wrote, I might not be talking to you right now! (laughing here from
Bruce, which really didn't make me feel any better - Ed). And you must have
been freaking, because there was hardly ANY bad feedback for the first two
months it was just all good. Then we got a couple of bad ones, like any band is
gonna do. The production is so much better compared to what the first album was
like. And it's different you know what I mean, but there's still lots of stuff
that sounds like Rigor Mortis from the first album to me, just better
production and a more mature band. Where we just didn't repeat ourselves, like
"Do that four times, do that four times." You know what I mean, just the
typical patterns and stuff.
- But that first album, there was such a ferocity, just an
overwhelmingly powerfully evil sound to the whole thing. I kinda understand
where bands are coming from, I mean look at Slayer, they released "Reign In
Blood," and it's like, on the one hand you've released the greatest fucking
album you could ever make but on the other hand, it's a double edged sword
because you go "well, son of a bitch, what the fuck do we do now?" (laughing).
You know, we've made possibly the best album we could ever create?
It's one of those things where the artist transcends their work, and they've
created something that is almost just inhuman to be made.
Yeah, and that's how a lot of people are with that first album. The songs are
just so good. We wish the production and the sound of that first album would
have been so much better than how it turned out. And it woulda sounded like
what we sound like when we played in the jam room or live. But a lot of people
got used to it even though it was a terrible produced album. The songs made up
for it, you know what I'm saying? But even though that album coulda sounded
better, and like 'Slaves To The Grave...' a hundred times better sounding
album. People are just so partial to something they've heard for 30 years, that
how are they all of a sudden gonna like the new album overnight just as much as
something they've been listening to for 30 years. It's just not gonna happen,
it's gonna take a little time.
That's why I don't even pay attention if the reviewer told me they've only
listened to the album a couple of times. I'm like "are you fucking kidding me?"
- That's not even a basis for a review! Me personally, if I haven't
listened to an album at least ten times, I'm not even qualified to speak of it!
Sometimes the hardest thing for me to do is sit here and listen to an album
that I absolutely fucking hate, because it's like "well, I'm trying to find
something good in it." And the reverse is true; when I have an album I
absolutely love I mean, it's gonna command time in my CD player anyway, but it's
almost like I'm trying too hard to be nitpicky, 'cause you just go "this can't
be a 100!" (laughing).
It's just ridiculous. Being a fan of bands I grew up on, and I would get the
new Iron Maiden, well, you know, I've been listening to "Piece Of Mind" for the
last year, every day to where when I get "Powerslave," I'm not gonna love it...
I mean I might think this is bad ass, but it'll take me awhile to get used to
it, you know what I mean? But I wouldn't have sat down and tried to compare it
to "Number Of The Beast" or "Piece Of Mind" the first or second time I'm
listening to it (laughing here).
- I think it's just like I said the ferocity of that first album. I
kinda parallel that like when I was in Hallows Eve, and Hallows Eve had been
inactive for several years. (To a degree - Ed). I told Tommy I thought the
appropriate thing for H.E. to do would be to put out a record that sounds like
the early days, let everybody know you're back. And then over the course of the
band's lifespan... You kinda want to slowly work the different and diverse
elements in, you don't really want to come back after 10 or 15 years and
blindside people with "oh, this is what we sound like NOW," you know? People
want to know that you still know what the essence of Hallows Eve was to begin
with.
I don't know if the band ever understood that, I don't know if I just sounded
like some arrogant fucking asshole, but I wanted to do everything I could to
make that band succeed because I kinda felt it was my personal responsibility.
And maybe I was wrong to a degree but you gotta remember, I've been in the
music business for over 25 years, I knew a FEW things. Just from talking to
bands, talking to record labels. I dunno, maybe I come off as an arrogant prick
but I just wanted to help. That was the whole deal.
(long pause). Yeah, I mean I'm reading this thing about "Slaves To The Grave"
now, and I'm kinda shocked to be honest to be reading something this bad about
an album that we feel so strongly about. And I can't agree with anything you're
saying here. I mean "the vocals don't sound as heavy as the first..." Hell, it
sounds like I'm baby talking and like a little kid on that first album...
(Imitates a somewhat whiny voice). "In five easy slices, you're in six lovely
pieces!" Now I sound way more evil, way more demonic and powerful. I'm not
understanding what you're hearing there dude. You know? It's pretty strange to
me (laughs) because I make fun of my vocals on the first demo and that first
album because I'm so unsure of myself, and they're so weak and timid compared
to what I do now. Like my wife doesn't even like this kinda music, but when she
heard the first album she kinda laughed, because she'd been around recent Rigor
Mortis and Warbeast shows. And I took her back, you know "and this is how I
sounded back in 88" you know, and she didn't think I sounded more evil or
demonic or anything, the vocals are more acceptable and meek... I dunno.
I know how people love that album, but to sing the way I do on that first
album, I really gotta take myself back and step down a notch from where I've
went to and what I've grown and learned over the years and what I'm able to do
compared to that first album. It's like going backwards, kinda. I don't know
whether I'm explaining that right but it's true. I'm having to go in reverse
to do more simplistic, less difficult kinda of vocals. It's all cool, I don't
think I saw this one, (the review - Ed) I might have. But it's unfortunate for
someone who liked that first album so much to not like this last one.
- But the thing is, with the Warbeast stuff... It doesn't matter WHAT
you've done, it still sounds like Bruce. Even the new stuff. You know, it could
have just been to me the mix was off. Personally to me, with the Warbeast
stuff, I thought the mix was off, I thought you were too levelled in the mix, I
thought your vocals should have been brought up a bit more.
Thank you man.
- Granted now, what I'm saying is because, so far I haven't really
had time to digest this album and so far I've only listened to it in the car in
a CD player with 4 speakers. (Yeah, I'm in full retreat mode, but what I'm
saying is still true - Ed.) So it might sound... You never know, you'd be
surprised how different an album can sound when you play it on different sound
sources. But I definitely thought the vocals should have been brought out a lot
more since your vocals are the potent force of whatever the fuck it is you're
doing (I'm obviously stumbling here as the full weight of this coversation
really hits home hard).
Yeah, I've gotta agree with you on that. On "Slaves To The Grave," they got my
vocals cranked up nice and loud, so I definitely don't have any problems because
hell, the band WANTED my vocals up loud like they were on all my releases. And
this Warbeast one it's too (laughing hard here), you're right, it's too level.
And that's the only problem, I'm listening to it, and I'm just like, man. You
could understand what I'm saying better if it would have been up a little
louder. It just depends on the band. With Rigor Mortis, the guys preferred the
vocals to be up; with Warbeast, I'm always competing with guys that are scared
I'm covering up their guitar riffs. (MUCH laughter on both sides). It's just
kinda funny, because they're playing through the whole song and I'm only
singing on like 30% of a song or something, where I'm not even there most of
the time.
- If I sit down and think about it, and I remember... A lot of the
songs on "Slaves To The Grave..." It's really weird because 'Flesh For Flies'
(off the "Slaves..." album) REALLY fucking stands out on this album. Hell, this
could have been on the debut record. I think to me, it just seems like a lot of
the material didn't have that same essence, that same power. You know what I'm
saying? Maybe trying to sing to that you weren't in that same range, or frame,
or mindset that you were when you sang songs from the first album that were so
punishing that they demanded an extra response from you deep down. I dunno,
maybe I'm not explaining that right either, but that's just kinda how I feel.
Mike's a brilliant guitarist, no doubt about that. It seems like the album just
kinda suffered a bit from too much melody and... I dunno, it's hard to mix
those two things together and get a potent record. But I guess maybe you can
see where I'm coming from with that.
We were showing more versatility by having some of those melodic solos in those
songs. Where it wasn't just plain full speed the whole time. But I don't think
forever for a second that I back off on the vocals or the lyrical subjects or
anything. I'm writing about fragance of corpses about carrying around... my
best friends are dead bodies that I put together from other pieces of other
bodies and stuff. I allowed those guys to write lyrics to some of the songs as
well.
You also didn't hear some of those songs live, and for a few years we were
playing a few of them live. They definitely went over very well live when we
played 'em.
- I know sometimes I'm a weird... Sometimes people can be a weird one
in the metal scene. Like you know, I always preferred Jake E. Lee's Ozzy
Osbourne stuff to the stuff that Randy Rhoads did. No disrespect to Randy, but
I just thought Jake E. Lee was a more emotional player. A lot of times, that's
what I'm looking for in extreme music. Whether it's gut ripping, anti-christian
black metal, or just a really beautiful Pink Floyd vibe like say Therion or
Tiamat or Throes Of Dawn does.
I like music that evokes strong emotion. Whether it's one direction or the
other. And I guess this just didn't really speak to me on that level. Because
obviously I am into music that's QUITE different from the mainstream or the
norm, and I guess I just demand more out of the music that I love and listen
to. I guess that can sometimes be a bad thing.
Well, pretty narrow minded, probably. But a lot of people, if they were
expecting us to do the first album again, they were going to be disappointed.
But I can name just as many things on the first album that had slow... the slow
intro to 'Demons' and the first part of 'Slow Death.' It's not like that whole
album was just blistering a million miles an hour. I knew what the people
wanted; it had nothing do with anything, you mentioned something about Bruce's
personal life or whatever might have had something to do with why... No, I'm
the one that's fighting for the sicker lyrics. If you're seeing in other albums
they went away from the horror stuff. A lot of it; but it was me, like "Man, we
need to have more like this, we need to have more like the first album." To try
to get that part in there, naturally we didn't want to recreate the first album
but I knew what fans of the first album were wanting. So I at least made sure...
And that's how 'Flesh For Flies' came about. And some of those songs like that.
- I had no problems with the lyrics at all.
Right. And then like I said, I let my wife after hearing "Slaves To The Grave"
which she was more familiar with. And to go back and put on the first album,
and she would say the exact opposite of you! (much laughter on both sides). She
thinks I sound like a wimp on that first album! And I do you know compared
to... Just because I started having more confidence in myself; to put out more
force. I was getting away from being very unsure of myself and I was just
barely belting it out.
- Well I remember the story you told me about that where you said that
you were stabbed and you were blowing up balloons to try to get your lung
strength back. You know, I think that impressed me a lot more when I heard
those... Some of those hellish screams man. One of my favorite tracks off the
debut is 'Die In Pain,' and it's like. That's almost just evilly inhuman that
"Rrraaaaaagh!" I love the fuck out of that you know.
I'll be honest with you, I'm gonna go back and sit down and relisten to the
album. I'm pretty sure I didn't MISS anything, because I do REMEMBER the album.
It's not like "oh, well maybe I just didn't pay attention," I do remember stuff
off the album.
Nah, I just think if you were so partial with the first album that you weren't
gonna be as accepting of uh... Well, the first song there's a 3 or 4 minute
long melodic Iron Maiden sounding guitar solo that comes at the end of the
album. After it's the fastest shit you ever heard in your life, or the first
half of 'Poltergeist.' Then you go and then you have the second half is like it
could be part of Iron Maiden's epic long, one of their... 'Rime Of The Ancient
Mariner' or something. It's just the versatility that Mike wanted to display on
that album. And it, it's weird because a lot of people around here... They
loved the fast and crazy part of Rigor Mortis but that's the part that makes
them appreciate Mike and his loss even more, because a lot of people didn't
realize that he had such a wide arsenal of talent that he could do different
shit. They just thought he was like "ah, he can just play fast," no, he can
play ANYTHING.
- I definitely noted that, he can definitely play; he's diverse. I
kinda feel bad even bringing that up, man, I feel like maybe I should have just
left that out. But I'm pretty much an honest dude, man, I try to... It's a hard
part of this business because there's a LOT of bands that have disappointed me
in recent years. (sighs). I hope you don't hate me because of that. (sad
laughter here).
Naw, man. Luckily there was enough of the good stuff out there that a lot of
people liked. I didn't expect 100% even though for like the first two months,
it seemed like it was almost all positive. Then when we finally got a few bad
reviews, we were kinda in shock, like what? (laughs). I was thinking everybody
loved it!
- Well, at least you know I'm going to be honest about it.
We didn't expect it to be that way from the beginning. It was just the early
reviews were all good. And then of course people probably being kind about it
because of the loss of Mike. But the Warbeast, this is like the first album you
actually listened to then?
- (laughing) Yeah, unfortunately!
Wow. That's wild because I started doing it like, not long after... Actually
the first show was 2006. It was only a year after the Rigor Mortis reunion when
we did that first show. It was probably about 10 years ago when we first had
the full lineup and started making it official, where we're playing and about
to write a demo and all that stuff. The first album came out in 2010. But we've
been around for awhile, man!
- I noticed that. For one thing, you guys are on Housecore. Phil
Anselmo was JUST starting the label out when you guys got picked up. There
hasn't been really anybody working press and PR on my side of things until Liz
Ciavarella from Earsplit took over that. That may have been the reason why.
Dude, you would be surprised if you saw my promo list. I service about,
goddamn, must be 70 or 80 different record labels from ALL over the globe.
There just ain't enough hours in the day to get to everything. That's probably
why I missed out on "Destroy." Hell, I may have that album on the hard drive
from one of my promo people I think at the time I just didn't make the
connection. If I had known you were singing on that record I would have given
it a LOT more priority, BELIEVE ME! (laughing here).
Of course, "The Enemy" from 2010. If you went back now you'd find that all
three albums are... you can tell it's Warbeast but they're not all... They've
got versatility as well, as far as sounding different on each album. The vocals
will give you that sound of a band, the guitar riffs like you said from
Gammacide and my vocals. That gives us the sound of Warbeast.
- That's a great match too the more that I think about it; Gammacide
thrashy riffing and your sick fucking vocals on top of that. Now I'm not going
to lie to you; there's a couple of songs where I heard a few passages where I'm
like "eh, I'm not really digging that." But once everything opened up, it was
like the floodgates. I think maybe it was 'Ancient Hate' that started out kinda
strange. No it was 'Chemicals Consuming' that's what it was, I'm like "man,
they must have done some chemicals when they started the opening riffs on that"
(laughing here) but like I said it opened up and it just floored.
I've listened to the album twice all the way through but so far I'm fucking
LOVING what I'm hearing man, definitely.
Cool. Like I said, maybe one day you'll be able to get back and check out some
of our other ones. Bringing the horror into Warbeast when I can, you know, we
didn't want to be the same band. I've not changed or mellowed or pussed out in
any way. I KNEW people wanted to hear more... I knew that some people hearing
"Slaves To The Grave" were going to be expecting stuff from the first album.
And I had so much pull myself to get as much of that stuff on there as I could.
And being open minded to knowing that not everybody's gonna love it like you.
But that hopefully everybody would be open enough to hearing a different side
of Rigor Mortis and still saying that we haven't totally sold out. Because that
same song you're hearing that beautiful melodic solo, the same song you were
hearing some the most blistering, heavy, fast shit you could ever hear. It
ain't like the whole song was just all... totally pussy shit! (laughing here).
- Well, I wouldn't have accused "Slaves To The Grave" as being pussy
shit. AT ALL. I dunno man it's... Ah. I dunno, I kinda feel like I just really,
REALLY didn't wanna go there.
And you know, that brings up another point too, because... So many metalheads
today... I'm not going to say they're stuck in the past. But you think about...
Bands that are trying to... Nobody wants to hear... AC/DC made a career off of
making the same album for 20 years. I'll go see them live all day long, but
when it comes to a new album it's like, you know, what are they really doing
nowadays.
But why do you think it is that most metalheads are resistant to change? You
think they're just hanging on to nostalgia, do you think they're realizing that
they're getting older and older. And I know my music tastes have changed a
little bit since I've gotten older. I've gotten into more melodic things. I
guess the metal collaborative in general... These guys are 50, 60 and 70 years
old still making albums. You can't really expect them to have that demonic rage
and pissed off anger that they had when they were 18 and 20. So you know, what
the fuck do you do, you know?
Well, like I said, I still wanted to be the heaviest, fastest thing, and that's
what I would do if it were up to me. But I got musicians to work with (laughing
here - Ed). Obviously, you can hear Rigor Mortis and Warbeast definitely not
selling out. I understand what it's like for one of my favorite bands to puss
out you know what I mean. It lets you down. So being on that side of it as a
fan, I'm always not wanting to disappoint any of the fans we have that became a
fan of ours BECAUSE it was so brutal and heavy or gory or whatever.
It's not as scared of change or whatever as sometimes it's... You don't change
yourself but sometimes you realize that's what people are expecting out of you.
- I think in my 25 years of covering bands, I think what I expect...
Even in my life today, I always say "well, one person wants to go one way..."
There's ALWAYS a middle ground. There's a way to add the influences in there
CORRECTLY and still retain that signature sound. It's not necessarily "well,
I'm compromising or I'm kowtowing." It's like, you know, I'm trying to grow as
an artist and still make the kind of music that people recognize.
Well, that's exactly what we thought we were doing on "Slaves To The Grave,"
but somebody like you maybe didn't get it (My dumb ass is laughing here,
because I "understand" where they're coming from by I really don't) because...
I mean we're not gonna sound like that first album because modern day
production... There's no way we could make ANY album ever sound like that
album again because it was such a fluke deal (laughter on both sides) at how
that album turned out that we're always kind of shocked that people loved... I
mean I dunno what you think about the production of the first album. But
imagine if that album would have had the production we all wanted and if it
would have have really sounded like that, would that album have been
remembered... We feel like "goddamn;" it sucks that it didn't turn out to sound
like it should. But then there's so many people that love that album that it's
been put into hall of fames and shit!
- I guess the best example I can give you is... I don't think Dark
Angel's "Darkness Descends" would have had the impact it had without that muddy
production, because it gave that album a very murky feeling. And on the flipside
of the coin, whenever I see Krisiun live... The death metal band from Brazil.
They sound CRUSHING live but on record their production is so crisp and clean
that it just sucks the life out of the music. It makes it sound so sterile and
it doesn't have that heaviness.
It's amazing to me how different a band can be live. Kataklysm, another band. I
can't get into them on record, but live they come over very well. Obviously I
don't look at every single album the exact same way. There are examples where
a murkier and not necessarily a crystal clear production adds to the overall
weight and heaviness. No other album in history that I know of is more the case
with that than Dark Angel's "Darkness Descends."
To us, that album just came out too clean and too thin sounding for what we
really sounded like. It had a lot to do with the producer we ended up using who
had never done metal before. And we were in a studio that had only done country
albums (laughing here - Ed). To us that album is just too clean! We would NEVER
sound like that first album as far as if you came and saw us live. And I can
tell by talking to you you would have loved how we sounded live if you had
heard these songs then you would understand what we were saying you would like
this album so much even more if we would have gotten a halfway decent kinda
production from it. It's clear and crystal clear, but when we cranked it up
live it had more rawness and balls to it. I'm always gonna love that album,
it's what I'm known for. I'm just sorta sad about... It's like a commercialized
version of Rigor Mortis, is what it sounds like to me. (laughing here - Ed).
Its sad because we really were a fast, brutal, evil band.
- The last time I talked to you was right after you did that show.
Which I wish someone had videotaped, because I'd LOVE to watch that again! You
said there was two songs you wanted to play live that they didn't let you play
live. It was 'Bodily Dismemberment' and... Fuck, I can't remember what the
other one was off the top of my head.
Right, well, they finally... The more time we had and the more shows we did...
Once it became... hey, this wasn't just a one time reunion, they finally opened
up to us playing that, different songs to the set list. So over time I did get
'Slow Death,' and 'Bodily Dismemberment' and some of those songs in there that
we weren't playing on the first tour. And that first tour was weird, I dunno if
you remember, but basically we played 15 songs or something, and I was only up
there for 8 of them. So half of the songs I wasn't even on stage for. That's
not a normal type situation and it didn't stay that way, because as we stayed
together more and more, Casey especially was like "man, we need you up there,
it gets kinda weird and different for the crowd when you're gone so much." So
it started becoming a deal where I started singing more, Casey started singing
less. And we kept it at the most where I'd only be gone for one or two songs
throughout the show.
- So I guess you didn't carry Doyle with you through the rest of the
tour?
No, no, that was just a one time thing.
- Wow. That was special for me, that was like... Even though I wasn't
a huge fan of THAT era of Rigor Mortis, I REALLY appreciated those songs a lot
more seeing his intensity in a live setting. So I definitely hear what you're
saying about maybe I should have seen some of the "Slaves To The Grave" stuff
live! (laughing here).
Yeah, because I ended up singing all those songs. Like, we let Doyle sing two
songs that night. Then all the other shows, I was singing them, you know what I
mean?
- Oh, man, I would have LOVED to see that live! (more laughter here).
Yeah, so, that's pretty much all we did. You saw a show where Casey sang two or
three, Doyle sang two then there was a couple of instrumentals. Later on, like
I said it would be like mainly a set of everything, and if it was songs I
didn't... You know, even off "Versus The Earth" I was singing those, songs
that Doyle had done. Now there was the "Freaks" demo that we did before
"Freaks" (the album release - Ed), that we might release... me singing those
songs like 'Cattle Mutilation,' and 'Freaks' and some of those other songs. We
might put that out just as a little something that we've never put out before;
me singing the Freaks demo. So those songs were all easy for me to do because I
was singing them before Doyle showed up.
- Wow, I'd love to hear that. You DEFINITELY need to put that...
"Release it! Release It!" (laughter from both of us here.
Yeah, well we're talking about it. We just released the 1986 demo last year on
CD for the first time. It was just a little 8 track cassette that we made like
500 copies of. Have you listened to that?
- Surprisingly, I haven't. I think the only song that's different
is... Well, there's 'The Troll' and 'Six Feet Under.' There's 'Foaming At The
Mouth,' well, we've all heard 'Foaming,' that was on the soundtrack to the
Decline Of Western Civilization movie.
But I'm just laughing because of the stuff I was telling you about how my
vocals were on the first album, were even MORE that way on the first demo.
Where it sounds like I'm (laughing here) "He seeks fresh bodies in the morgue!"
I mean, I'm a young kid, well, not a kid but a young man not knowing how to
sing and scared of what I'm doing. One of these days you'll have to go on
youtube and find that original demo and listen to some of those songs.
I can still go back and do those voices but it's like stepping back. Like, an
athlete that has to run slower or something (much laughter here from both of
us - Ed). You know? That's how I feel when I do try to sing like the first demo
or the first album. Which I do sometimes, you know what I mean? I might not
have had a big vocal range but I feel like I've got more strength and power and
balls to do different shit.
- No, it's kinda funny, because I remember a story where we were
looking at Sodom, a band from Germany, just released "The Final Sign Of Evil"
which was their "In The Sign Of Evil" Mini EP with extra tracks. This EP goes
all the way back to the early 80's. They just released this within the last 5
years. I remember reading an interview with Sodom where he talks about, I think
it was Witchfire, the guitarist, and he's like "Yeah, I didn't know how to play
back then, now I've got all these skills. And I'm trying to go back and play
those early songs and I'm like 'How the fuck did I do that?'" It's kinda funny,
it's kinda like the same thing. Trying to go back and remember as a skilled
guitarist how he played when he wasn't so skilled... (Laughter on both sides
here).
Now some of the stuff that amazes me when people like... bands or whatever, or
like myself... That some of the stuff that we came up with, ideas or the lyrics
or whatever for a song. Sometimes I'm like "wow, that was pretty clever" or
something. You might realize that you're a lot more experienced and everything
else now after so many years, and your skills are a lot better... But something
about that youth, you know, being young and angry and not BEING so
professional. (laughing here) Sometimes that creates some of the best moments
in metal.
- Oh yeah... Beautiful "accidents"...
Exactly. And a lot of that's why so many bands, a lot of their best stuff is on
their early albums. It does kinda get harder, even if you've improved and have
all this experience in the world. You have to compete with what you've already
done; it's kind of a weird situation as you get older. Hopefully I'll get to do
another one; right now I'm just thankful to be around to talk about this new
one (album - Ed).
- One final question... I've been doing a lot of videotaping of shows
lately. I usually get the bands' permission but I don't post but about three or
four songs. Just to kinda say "hey, you see this band's coming to your town,
this is what they're like."
Recently, it's interesting because the Wacken festival was sold out this year.
And I was able to sit down at my computer and watch... I watched Megadeth, I'd
never seen Megadeth live. I sat there and watched their entire show from
Wacken. It's kinda weird that it took the metal world so long to really catch
on to utilizing technology. How do you feel about that personally?
To me, there's nothing that beats the live experience, but shit man, they
stream courtroom documentaries now, you've got facebook live that can go
anywhere people can go. It's kinda natural. It seems like it takes the metal
world a long time to catch up, I dunno.
Well, I try to remain old school in my ways but also adapt to modern times and
use it to my advantage with the band and everything. I've definitely kept up
with the progression of things like what you can use to your advantage as far
as social media or the live videos.
I have nothing against it, I'm always like everybody's allowed to film, take
pictures, do whatever you want. I've actually went live myself, facebook live.
I did it during out Warbeast release show where Phil was singing for me like he
did last month. There's people all around the world right now; there's somebody
sitting at home on a Friday night that would like to be watching Phil up there
singing this Warbeast! There's disadvantages to everything but you have to
leave yourself a little bit of open mind and not throw away the past. It's
always good to still show up at a show and pass out a flyer and do stuff like
that. Don't ever let that part of it end. People are either gonna see it one
way or another, so why not let them see it WHILE it's happening.
WAY overdue... A lot happened to me last year, and the tragedies came in threes
to be sure; my live in girlfriend of 5 years left me, and shortly after that I
lost my job. The final blow was the passing of my father towards the end of the
year, and quite frankly I didn't have much desire to do any music magazine
stuff. Still, with the tragedies I suffered, 2017 was also the year of one of
my greatest triumphs in life, the thing I had strived for for many years and
unfortunately didn't achieve with Hallows Eve: my participation in the latest
Darkflight album, which saw me contributing clean sung vocals to half the
record. I STILL carry this album around with me wherever I go, as it was one of
my only constant reminders that the year wasn't a complete loss...
So here we are in 2018 with a magazine that should have come out right around
September of last year, right after or during ProgPower. I came to a
realization where I said things that I have said for years, like "why am I
continuing to do a project that brings me no income whatsoever." Sure, I do
still love metal, but a lot of this became WORK for me. And of course, after a
9 to 5 at the "office," sometimes I wanna come home and just play videogames or
watch a movie or something. You know how it is if you're a working sort. Still,
what motivated me the most to finally get off my lazy ass and get this thing
finished was after many, MANY years, this issue in particular had one very
important thing I had strived for for awhile: EVERY single interview in this
issue was conducted either by phone or streaming voice over the internet. A few
were even facebook voice chats! This however left me with a TON of transcribing
work to do, which felt monumental in and of itself. Especially when there were
multiple speakers, as was the case with the Cirith Ungol interview, or when the
vocals were in a heavy accent, as the case turned out to be with both Hobbs
Angel Of Death and Ritual. Still, I am very proud of this issue, despite the
lateness, as always, and I feel the interviews this time around were different,
diverse and very insightful. If I walk away from an interview laughing and
actually educating as well as informing our readers; at the end of the day it's
a great accomplishment. And still, when I look at these interviews, it's
amazing to me the common threads that connect seemingly unconnected bands; like
the production details of Dark Angel are discussed by both Don Doty from D.A.
AND Bruce Corbitt from Warbeast/Rigor Mortis. I sometimes think that unseen
forces guide my hand in conducting these interviews to where seemingly
unrelated and unconnected conversations gain familiarity from band to band. Or
it might be that I just need to stop asking the same damn questions in
interviews.
Darkflight... I still get people asking me this all the time. If you heard the
"The Hereafter" album, then you can finally imagine WHY it takes Ivo quite a
few years between album releases... The work Ivo and I put into this release
was frustrating at times, especially given the fact that though the very first
song we put together was done VERY quickly (and it was the track that Ivo
decided he wanted much more from me for the album, vocal wise), the last two
tracks were difficult given I had a hard time figuring out EXACTLY what it was
he wanted my vocals to sound like. The third song almost didn't happen; it was
literally a 13th hour decision that made the final track 'Sans Ame' such a
keeper. We stepped outside of ourselves and created a masterpiece. I am very
proud of what I did and I definitely look forward to the next release, even if
Ivo is (at the time of this writing) thoroughly exhausted both idea wise and
creatively. I never understood long delays between albums in bands, but being
so close to the heart and essence of this project it now makes perfect sense.
On a final note, I REALLY wanted to review the newest Darkflight album. I have
been told, by several people however, that because of my involvement, I should
recuse myself from doing so. You see, to me Darkflight's composer Ivo embodies
what I call the "top 5% of amazing musical composers" in the entire world. So
naturally, my list of must review bands always includes Darkflight, and has
since their second full length. That being said, I feel I COULD have reviewed
it, since I didn't write any of the music and only wrote lyrics for my vocals
on the three songs I appeared on. Having said that, as far as I'm concerned,
the album (were I to review it) would score a 98, with the few lone points
being taken off for, surprise! My vocals at the beginning of the CD. This was
a track that Ivo and I went back and forth on for awhile ('Crushed'), until he
finally settled on a somewhat low toned viking style of vocals I was
experimenting with. What's even more hilarious for me is how Ivo and I BOTH
"lament" over some of the Russian and Ukranian doom bands that utilize low
toned clean sung vocals, which neither of us are crazy about. Still, I do have
an alternate version of the song with different vocals, including a different
delivery which I thought would have carried the song's ending further and
"ended" if you will on a more powerful note. Anyone that wants to hear it, feel
free to email me... Hopefully on future collaborations (which I am assured
there WILL be), we will see this alternate track released as a bonus... But
it's still Ivo's project and he's happy with my contributions, ALL of them. On
the next album I hope to be more involved and definitely write more lyrics.
I cannot tell you what the future brings for either DOOM Radio OR the music
magazine. This may very well indeed be the last issue of the magazine ever
written though somehow I doubt it. Many may have noticed less than 5 shows have
appeared in 2018, further proof that either I need some serious time off or
maybe I need to rethink priorities. I hate to see it all end after 26 years in
publication, but obviously a paying job (that I happen to enjoy) takes
precedence over what may be seen to many as a mere "hobby." At this point I
will take my leave by saying that as we get older, we don't seem to be as
passionate about the things we onced loved. I don't seem to attend as many
concerts as I used to, though I am right now enjoying taking part in the
Records Of Mass Destruction event that happens every Monday night in metro
Atlanta. Where will this publication be in 5 years? I cannot say. But I still
hope I am able and willing to support such great underground music, because I
definitely still enjoy discovering new bands from around the globe on a
constant basis...